24-2-00425-23 Karin Vartia et al v Susan L Mathers Noyes

Case Information

24-2-00425-23 | KARIN VARTIA et al vs SUSAN NOYES MATHERS

Case Number
24-2-00425-23

Court
Mason

File Date
05/31/2024

Case Type
MSC2 Miscellaneous – Civil

Case Status
Completed/Re-Completed

Party

Plaintiff
VARTIA, KARIN

Active Attorneys

Lead Attorney

ATKISSION, AARON JOSEPH

Retained



Plaintiff
KOWALSKI, EMMA

Active Attorneys

Lead Attorney

ATKISSION, AARON JOSEPH

Retained



Defendant
NOYES MATHERS, SUSAN

Active Attorneys

Lead Attorney

Scuderi, Joseph

Retained


Disposition Events

07/15/2024 Judgment


Judicial Officer
Stevens, David

Judgment Type
General Recovery


Monetary/Property Award

Creditors: KOWALSKI, EMMA, VARTIA, KARIN

Debtors: NOYES MATHERS, SUSAN

Signed Date: 07/15/2024

Filed Date: 07/15/2024

Effective Date: 07/15/2024

Current Judgment Status:

Status: Vacated

Status Date: 07/29/2024

Monetary Award:

Fee: Attorney Fee, Amount: $7,842.00 , Interest: 12.00 %

Fee: Costs, Amount: $415.65 , Interest: 12.00 %

Total: $8,257.65

Comment


08/15/2024 Judgment


Judicial Officer
Goodell, Daniel L

Judgment Type
General Recovery


Monetary/Property Award

Creditors: KOWALSKI, EMMA, VARTIA, KARIN

Debtors: NOYES MATHERS, SUSAN

Signed Date: 08/15/2024

Filed Date: 08/15/2024

Effective Date: 08/15/2024

Current Judgment Status:

Status: Active

Status Date: 08/15/2024

Monetary Award:

Fee: Attorney Fee, Amount: $7,842.00 , Interest: 12.00 %

Fee: Costs, Amount: $415.65 , Interest: 12.00 %

Total: $8,257.65

Satisfaction Details:

Date: 02/28/2025

Amount: $8,422.80

Comment: $82.58 REMAINING

Comment

Comment ()


Events and Hearings

  • 1 05/31/2024 Case Information Cover Sheet View Document Case Information Cover Sheet
    • 2 05/31/2024 Motion for Order to Show Cause View Document Motion for Order to Show Cause
  • 3 05/31/2024 Declaration Affidavit View Document Declaration Affidavit Comment
    IN SUPPORT OF MOTION TO SHOW CAUSE
  • 4 05/31/2024 Order to Show Cause View Document Order to Show Cause Judicial Officer
    Butler, Tirsa C
  • 5 05/31/2024 Motion Hearing View Document Motion HearingJudicial Officer
    Butler, Tirsa C
  • 6 06/12/2024 Affidavit Declaration Certificate Confirmation of Service View Document Affidavit Declaration Certificate Confirmation of Service
  • 7 06/13/2024 Affidavit Declaration Certificate Confirmation of Service View Document Affidavit Declaration Certificate Confirmation of Service
  • 8 06/17/2024 Show Cause Original Type
    Show CauseView Document Mason MinutesJudicial Officer
    Stevens, David Hearing Time
    1:30 PM Result
    Held Comment
    SOPHIA SUM CONFIRMED VIA EMAIL 06/13/0224 @ 8:35AM JB Parties Present Plaintiff Attorney: ATKISSION, AARON JOSEPH Plaintiff Attorney: ATKISSION, AARON JOSEPH Defendant: NOYES MATHERS, SUSAN Attorney: Scuderi, Joseph
  • 9 06/17/2024 Motion Hearing View Document Mason Minutes Judicial Officer
    Stevens, David
  • 10 06/17/2024 Notice of Appearance View Document Notice of Appearance
  • 11 06/17/2024 Declaration Affidavit View Document Declaration Affidavit Comment
    OF J. VINCENT MCCLURE, P.E., S.E.
  • 12 06/17/2024 Lis Pendens View Document Lis Pendens
  • 13 06/17/2024 Answer and Counterclaim View Document Answer and Counterclaim
  • 14 06/17/2024 Order of Continuance View Document Order of Continuance Judicial Officer
    Stevens, David Comment
    SHOW CAUSE
  • 15 07/05/2024 Notice of Absence Unavailability View Document Notice of Absence Unavailability Comment
    JOSEPH SCUDERI UNAVAILABLE 7/15
  • 16 07/15/2024 Show Cause Original Type
    Show CauseView Document Mason MinutesJudicial Officer
    Stevens, David Hearing Time
    1:30 PM Result
    Held Parties Present Plaintiff Attorney: ATKISSION, AARON JOSEPH Plaintiff Attorney: ATKISSION, AARON JOSEPH
  • 17 07/15/2024 Motion Hearing View Document Mason Minutes Judicial Officer
    Stevens, David
  • 18 07/15/2024 Affidavit View Document Affidavit Comment
    RE: ATTORNEY FEES
  • 19 07/15/2024 Judgment View Document Judgment Judicial Officer
    Stevens, David Comment
    AND ORDER
  • 07/15/2024 Case Resolution Statistical Completion
  • 20 07/18/2024 Notice of Hearing View Document Notice of Hearing Comment
    RECONSIDERATION
  • 21 07/18/2024 Motion for Reconsideration View Document Motion for Reconsideration Comment
    OF ENTRY OF JUDGMENT ON ATTORNEY FEES
  • 22 07/18/2024 Declaration Affidavit View Document Declaration Affidavit
  • 23 07/24/2024 Response View Document Response Comment
    TO DEFENDANT’S MOTION FOR RECONSIDERATION OF ENTRY OF JUDGMENT ON ATTORNEY FEES AND COSTS
  • 24 07/24/2024 Declaration Affidavit View Document Declaration Affidavit
  • 25 07/25/2024 Affidavit Declaration Certificate Confirmation of Service View Document Affidavit Declaration Certificate Confirmation of Service
  • 26 07/25/2024 Reply View Document Reply Comment
    IN SUPPORT OF MOTION FOR RECONSIDERATION OF ENTRY OF JUDGMENT ON ATTORNEY FEES
  • 27 07/29/2024 Motion Hearing Original Type
    Motion Hearing View Document Mason Minutes Judicial Officer
    Stevens, David Hearing Time
    1:30 PM Result
    Held Comment
    RECONSIDERATION COMFIRMED VIA PHONE CALL ON 7/24/24 @ 2:50 PM BY SUSAN MATHERS- SG Parties Present Plaintiff: VARTIA, KARIN Attorney: ATKISSION, AARON JOSEPH Plaintiff: KOWALSKI, EMMA Attorney: ATKISSION, AARON JOSEPH Defendant: NOYES MATHERS, SUSAN Attorney: Scuderi, Joseph
  • 28 07/29/2024 Order on Motion for Reconsideration View Document Order on Motion for Reconsideration Judicial Officer
    Stevens, David
  • 29 07/29/2024 Order for Hearing View Document Order for Hearing Judicial Officer
    Stevens, David Comment
    FEES AND COSTS
  • 30 07/29/2024 Motion Hearing View Document Mason Minutes Judicial Officer
    Stevens, David
  • 31 08/02/2024 Notice of Hearing View Document Notice of Hearing Comment
    TO DISMISS DEFENDANT’S COUNTERCLAIM AND FOR ATTORNEY FEES AND COSTS
  • 32 08/02/2024 Petition View Document Petition Comment
    FOR ATTORNEY FEES AND COSTS
  • 33 08/02/2024 Motion to Dismiss View Document Motion to Dismiss Comment
    DEFENDANT’S COUNTER CLAIM, STRIKE DISCOVERY AND RELEASE LIS PENDENS
  • 34 08/07/2024 Affidavit Declaration Certificate Confirmation of Service View Document Affidavit Declaration Certificate Confirmation of Service
  • 35 08/07/2024 Response View Document Response Comment
    RE: REQUESTED ATTORNEY FEES
  • 36 08/07/2024 Response View Document ResponseComment
    TO PLAINTIFFS’ MOTION TO DISMISS COUNTER CLAIM
  • 37 08/07/2024 Declaration Affidavit View Document Declaration Affidavit
  • 38 08/07/2024 Declaration Affidavit View Document Declaration Affidavit
  • 08/12/2024 Motion Hearing Judicial Officer
    Goodell, Daniel L Hearing Time
    1:30 PM Cancel Reason
    Unspecified Comment
    FEES AND COSTS HEARING CONFIRMED BY SOPHIA SUM VIA EMAIL ON 8/8/24 @ 8:41AM CRR
  • 39 08/12/2024 Motion Hearing Original Type
    Motion Hearing View Document Mason MinutesJudicial Officer
    Goodell, Daniel LHearing Time
    1:30 PM Result
    Held Comment
    TO DISMISS DEFENDANT’S COUNTER CLAIM AND FOR ATTORNEY FEES AND COSTS HEARING CONFIRMED BY SOPHIA SUM VIA EMAIL ON 8/8/24 @ 8:41AM CRR Parties Present PlaintiffAttorney: ATKISSION, AARON JOSEPH Plaintiff: KOWALSKI, EMMA Attorney: ATKISSION, AARON JOSEPH Defendant: NOYES MATHERS, SUSAN Attorney: Scuderi, Joseph
  • 40 08/12/2024 Motion Hearing View Document Mason Minutes Judicial Officer
    Goodell, Daniel L
  • 41 08/12/2024 Order Setting View Document Order Setting Judicial Officer
    Goodell, Daniel L Comment
    PRESENTATION OF ORDER
  • 42 08/13/2024 Release View Document Release Comment
    OF LIS PENDENS
  • 43 08/15/2024 Judgment View Document Judgment Judicial Officer
    Goodell, Daniel L Comment
    AND ORDER
  • 08/15/2024 Ex Parte Action With Order Judicial Officer
    Goodell, Daniel L
  • 08/20/2024 Motion Hearing Judicial Officer
    Goodell, Daniel L Hearing Time
    3:00 PM Cancel Reason
    Stricken
  • 44 03/05/2025 Partial Satisfaction of Judgment View Document Partial Satisfaction of Judgment
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Politics of Mainstream Psychology v Liberation Theology

by Bruce E Levine

When I first heard the term liberation theology (in opposition to a theol­ogy that fosters compliance with the status quo), I thought there should also be a liberation psychology—a psychology that doesn’t equate a lack of adjustment with mental illness, but instead promotes constructive rebel­lion against dehumanizing institutions, and which also provides strategies to build a genuinely democratic society.

It turned out that somebody else had thought of the same thing before I had.

Ignacio Martin-Baró (1942–1989) was both a priest and a psychologist, and it is he who should be given credit for popularizing the term liberation psychology.

Martin-Baró’s liberation theology, liberation psychology, and activism for the people of El Salvador cost him his life. In the middle of the night on November 16, 1989, Martin-Baró, together with five colleagues, their housekeeper, and her teenage daughter, were forced out to a courtyard on the campus of Universidad Centroamericana José Simeón Cañas, where they were murdered by the US-trained troops of the Salvadoran government’s elite Atlacatl Battalion.

As a Jesuit priest, Martin-Baró embraced liberation theology in opposi­tion to a theology that oppressed the poor, and as a social psychologist, he believed that imported North American psychology also oppresses marginalized people.

The Politics of Mainstream Psychology

Martin-Baró believed that the prevailing mainstream psychology had become infatuated with methods and measurements and thus was ignor­ing unquantifiable realities necessary for liberation.

Such unquantifiable but powerful human dimensions include commitment, solidarity, hope, and courage.

He saw a mainstream psychology that either ignored or only paid lip service to social and economic conditions that shape people’s lives.

In Writings for a Liberation Psychology, a compilation of Martin-Baró’s essays, editors Adrianne Aron and Shawn Corne point out that libera­tion psychology is about looking at the world from the point of view of the dominated instead of the dominators.

Martin-Baró drew heavily on the work of Paulo Freire, the Brazilian educator, who recognized a certain “psychology of oppres­sion” in which the downtrodden become fatalistic, believing they are powerless to alter their circumstances, thus becoming resigned to their situation.

The prevailing organizational psychology that Martin-Baró criticizes is one that promotes an alienation of working people by serving the needs of industry. In his essay “Toward a Liberation Psychology,” Martin-Baró points out:

What has happened to Latin American psychology is similar to North American psychology at the beginning of the twen­tieth century, when it ran so fast after scientific recognition and social status that it stumbled . . . In order to get social position and rank, it negotiated how it would contribute to the needs of the established power structure.

Prevailing psychological theories are not politically neutral. Martin-Baró astutely observed that many mainstream psychological schools of thought—be they psychoanalytic, behavioral, or biochemical—accept the maximization of pleasure as the motivating force for human behavior, the same maximization of pleasure that is assumed by neoclassical economic theorists. This ignores the human need for fairness, social justice, freedom, and autonomy as well as other motivations that would transform society.

Martin-Baró pointed out that when knowledge is limited to verifi­able facts and events, we “become blind to the most important meanings of human existence.” Great scientists recognize this, as a sign hanging in Albert Einstein’s office at Princeton stated: “Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted.” Much of what makes us fully human and capable of overcom­ing injustices—including our courage and solidarity—cannot be reduced to simplistic, verifiable, objective variables.

In American society, mental health treatment is a significant force that can work either for or against genuine democracy. There are approaching eight hundred thousand social workers, psychiatrists, and psychologists working in the United States today (though not all provide mental health services), as well as many mental health counselors and paraprofession­als. The US Surgeon General reported in 1999 that 15 percent of adults and 21 percent of children and adolescents in the United States utilize mental health services each year, and it is likely that these percentages have increased.

Whether they realize it or not, mental health professionals who narrowly treat their clients in a way that encourages compliance with the status quo are acting politically.

Similarly, validating a client’s challenging of these undemocratic hierarchical modes is also a political act.

I believe that mental health professionals have an obligation to recognize the broader issues that form a context for their clients’ mental well-being, and to be honest with their clientele about which side of this issue they are on.

When Truths Do and Do Not Set People Free

Martin-Baró, tragically prescient, once quipped to a North American colleague, “In your country, it’s publish or perish. In ours, it’s publish and perish.”

In contrast with Martin-Baró, US intellectual activists have a considerable degree of free speech, and it requires no great heroism for US citizens to acquire their books or hear them speak and to discover truths.

Truths do sometimes set people free, especially when people have a basis of strength to start with. And truths can be especially energizing when, as was the case with Martin-Baró, proclaiming them takes courage.

Similarly, Tom Paine’s truths in Common Sense energized many colonials to take action against the British. Paine’s readers had not lost their self-respect, community, and sense of power. Paine’s audience also knew that Paine was risking his life to write and publish Common Sense. The power of truth to energize often lies in the risk that it takes to state it.

Generally in the United States, telling the truth about corporate-government tyranny and injustice requires little real risk, and so such truths provide little energy.

It is not that there is no value in exposing more truths about the corporatocracy. However, many professional activ­ists and educators have become lazy, pursing only easy, risk-free truths that are not energizing.

I wish my declaring the truth of people’s personal abusive relation­ships or the truth of their systemic corporate-governmental abuse were enough to set them free.

I wish that the people I know caught up in this state of helplessness could be spurred to action by lectures—that would be an easy fix. But more often, lectures are a turnoff.

What these victims of abuse need is the strength to do something with the truth of their abuse—strength that comes from support, morale, healing, and self-respect, as well as practical strategies and tactics.

The oppression faced by the Salvadorans whom Martin-Baró worked with was different from the oppression we face in the United States today, yet oppression need not be physically brutalizing in order to damage the bonds of community and people’s sense of self-worth.

We would do well to reject a mainstream psychology that tacitly fosters compliance to the status quo.

In contrast, we need a liberation psychology that promotes constructive rebellion against dehumanizing institutions and, at the same time, aims at building a genuinely democratic society.

In the United States, liberation psychology needs to focus on the specific ways Americans have been pacified and demoralized. And it must focus on how we can be made whole again, so as to regain strength to fight for ourselves and our communities.

Liberation Psychology in Practice

My form of practiced liberation psychology stems from my clinical expe­rience. It is decidedly in opposition to resentment-producing coercions; it is about helping individuals and families build respectful relationships.

I have counseled hundreds of young people and adults who had been previously labeled with oppositional defiant disorder, attention deficit hyperactivity disorder, substance abuse, depression, schizophrenia, and other psychiatric diagnoses.

What strikes me is how many of these people are essentially anti-authoritarians.

A major problem for these young anti-authoritarians is that most mental health professionals who had previ­ously diagnosed them have no familiarity with political ideologies that far better characterize these teenagers’ thinking and behaviors than does any mental disorder.

The word anarchism is routinely used by today’s mass media synony­mously with chaos, but for philosophers and political scientists, anarchism means people organizing themselves without authoritarian hierarchies.

Practical anarchism is not a dogmatic system and actually does not oppose all authority.

So, for example, practical anarchist parents will use their authority to grab their child who has begun to run out in traffic. However, practical anarchists strongly believe that all authorities have the burden of proof to justify control, and that most authorities in modern society cannot bear that burden and are thus illegitimate—and should be elimi­nated and replaced by noncoercive, freely participating relationships.

A minority of the anti-authoritarian kids I have worked with are aware of anarchism and identify themselves as anarchists, perhaps having T-shirts with a circle drawn around an A.

However, even among those adolescents who know nothing of the political significance of the term anarchism, I cannot remember one who didn’t become excited to discover that there is an actual political ideology that encompasses their point of view.

They immediately became more whole after they discovered that answering “yes” to the following questions does not mean that they suffer from a mental disorder but that they have a certain political philosophy:

• Do you hate coercion?

• Do you love freedom?

• Are you willing to risk punishments to gain freedom?

• Do you distrust large, impersonal, and distant authorities?

• Do you reject centralized authority and believe in participa­tory democracy?

• Do you hate powerful bigness of any kind?

• Do you hate laws and rules that benefit the people at the top and make life miserable for people at the bottom?

There are different varieties of anarchism and there are different varieties of disruptive people, and these varieties are worth examining.

One group of freedom lovers hates money, inequality, and exploitation of any kind. They reject a capitalist economy and aim for a society based on cooperative, mutually owned enterprise.

They are essen­tially leftist-anarchists—“anarcho-socialists,” “anarcho-syndicalists,” or “anarcho-communitarians.”

If they discover what Noam Chomsky, Peter Kropotkin, and Emma Goldman have to say, they identify with them. They have a strong moral streak of egalitarianism and a desire for social and economic justice.

Another group of freedom lovers also hates the coercion of parents, schools, and the state but, unlike these left-anarchists, they view capitalist markets as ideal for organizing virtually all aspects of society, and they lack an egalitarian moral streak.

A political ideology that they can connect with is called “anarcho-capitalism,” “libertarian anarchy,” or “market anar­chy,” and some become fans of Murray Rothbard or Ayn Rand.

Anti-authoritarians also can be distinguished by their views on violence as a way of achieving their goals. While many freedom lovers adhere to nonviolence, others consider violence an acceptable tool and will physi­cally or psychologically victimize others to get what they want.

Historically, the question of violence has sharply divided anti-authoritarians in their battle to eliminate unjust and illegitimate authority.

If a nonviolent anarcho-communitarian is dragged by parents into my office for failing to take school seriously but is otherwise pleasant and industrious, I tell parents that I do not believe that there is anything essentially “disordered” with their child.

This sometimes gets me fired, but not all that often.

It is my experience that most parents may think that believing a society can function without coercion is naive but they agree that it’s not a mental illness, and they’re open to suggestions that will create greater harmony and joy within their family.

I work hard with parents to have them understand that their attempt to coerce their anti-authoritarian child not only has failed—that’s why they’re in my office—but will likely continue to fail.

And increasingly, the pain of their failed coercion will be compounded by the pain of their child’s resentment, which will destroy their relationship with their child and create even more family pain.

Many parents acknowledge that this resentment has already begun to happen.

I ask them if they would try to coerce their homosexual child into being heterosexual or vice versa, and most say, “Of course not!” And so they begin to see that temperamen­tally anti-authoritarian children cannot be similarly coerced without great resentment.

I work very differently with those anti-authoritarian kids who care only about freedom for themselves and have no problem victimizing others to get their way. These kids usually are initially receptive to me, especially when they hear my viewpoint on traditional schools. However, tension eventually enters our relationship when they hear my views on other matters, especially on the “soul.”

I may, for example, tell them that while I believe that they have not lost their soul, eventually people do lose their souls to the extent that they lie to others and to themselves, or to the extent that they act in ways to get the best deal for themselves without caring about the impact on others.

Often these kids will ask, “What happens if we lose our souls?”

I tell them that in our current economy, it is quite possible to be financially successful without a soul; but they will never have a friend whom they really care about, and so eventually nobody will care about them because human beings eventually stop caring about those who don’t care about them, and so they will have a friendless, loveless life.

Sometimes this has an impact, sometimes not. Just like political activism, therapy may have an immediate effect, have a delayed one, or not work at all.

Activists and therapists need to have humility, especially with regard to their affection and respect—or lack of thereof—for those they are working with.

If an activist or a therapist lacks such affection and respect, those whom they are working with will sense it and will likely be unre­ceptive.

Humility also means accepting that one is not capable of being helpful to everyone, and having faith that somebody else, perhaps at some other point of time, may well be helpful.

Liberation psychology, in short, is about helping create self-respect, respectful relationships, and empowerment, and it is about helping people reject the role of either victim or victimizer.

This was an excerpt from Get Up, Stand Up: Uniting Populists, Energizing the Defeated, and Battling the Corporate Elite (Chelsea Green, 2011) by Bruce E. Levine.

In this book, Levine describes how American institutions and culture have created a passive and defeated populace. But he also outlines how Americans can recover dignity, unity, and the energy to do battle, and provides specific strategies and tactics to wrest power away from the “corporatocracy” — the partnership of giant corporations, the extremely wealthy elite, and corporate-collaborator government officials.

Image credit: The mural was painted in 1984 by artists Miranda Bergman and O’Brien Thiele in San Francisco. A related book written by Mary Watkins and Helene Shulman use the mural as the book cover for “Toward Psychologies of Liberation.” Link in comments.

Bruce E. Levine is a clinical psychologist and author of Get Up, Stand Up: Uniting Populists, Energizing the Defeated, and Battling the Corporate Elite (Chelsea Green, April 2011). His Web site is brucelevine[dot]net

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WAR 1-3-26 via Venezuela

La desesperanza es el enemigo de la justicia.

Republican Rep. Thomas Massie invokes the Founding Fathers to HAMMER Trump for violating the Constitution and creating an Iraq-level quagmire in our own backyard with his insane kidnapping of Maduro!

Speaking on the House floor during debate over a War Powers resolution, Rep. Massie excoriated Trump for lying to the American people like George Bush did and setting the stage for disaster:

“James Madison warned us that in no part of the Constitution is more wisdom to be found than in the clause which confides the question of war and peace to the legislature and not the executive. Madison called it the crown jewel of Congress. The framers understood a simple truth.”

“To the extent that war-making power devolves to one person, liberty dissolves. If the president believes military action against Venezuela is justified and needed, he should make the case and Congress should vote before American lives and treasure are spent on regime change in South America. Let’s be honest about likely outcomes.”

Do we truly believe that Nicolas Maduro will be replaced by a modern-day George “Washington? How did that work out in Cuba, Libya, Iraq or Syria? […Viet Nam, Iran, Somalia, Chile, Afghanistan…?] Previous presidents told us to go to war over WMDs, weapons of mass destruction, that did not exist. Now it’s the same playbook except we’re told that drugs are the WMDs. If it were about drugs, we’d bomb Mexico or China or Colombia and the president would not have pardoned Juan Orlando Hernandez.”

“This is about oil and regime change and when it comes to regime change, we’ve already been down this road with Venezuela with nothing to show for it. In 2019, we recognized Juan Guaido. We seized their embassy here in DC.”

“We were told that regime change was imminent. Years later, Maduro remain[ed] in power. Today, we’re told to place our hopes in other exiled figures.”

“Edmundo Gonzalez and Maria Carina Machado. I wish them well, I do. But Congress should not express moral sympathy in the form of a blank check for military escalation and American lives.”

“And let’s take a moment to acknowledge the contradiction at the heart of this policy. This administration tells us that the Maduro regime is made up of narco terrorists and by escalating toward war, we would predictably create countless refugees. […or civil wat.] At the same time, this administration has moved to end temporary protected status for hundreds of thousands of Venezuelans and deports them back to the very regime it condemns.”

“So which is it? Are we prepared to receive swarms of the 25 million Venezuelans who will likely become refugees and billions in American treasure that will be used to destroy and inevitably rebuild that nation? Do we want a miniature Afghanistan in the Western Hemisphere?”

“If that cost is acceptable to this Congress, then we should vote on it as a voice of the people and in accordance with our Constitution. And yet today, here we aren’t even voting on whether to declare war or authorize the use of military force. All we’re voting on is a War Powers Resolution that strengthens the fabric of our republic by reasserting the plain and simple language in the Constitution that Congress must decide questions of war.”

It is truly pathetic to see how eagerly the Republicans in Congress have ceded their authority to their god-king Donald Trump. The hypocrisy of the Trump regime is as outrageous as their disrespect for the rule of law and our Constitution, and Congress needs to take swift action to punish Trump and his cronies.

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Washington Open Government Guide

Author

Eric M. Stahl, ericstahl@dwt.com
Michael J. Killeen, michaelkilleen@dwt.com
DAVIS WRIGHT TREMAINE
920 Fifth Avenue
Suite 3300
Seattle, Washington 98104
(206) 622-3150

Foreword

Washington’s public records and public meetings laws, passed separately in the early 1970s, are a product of the “open government” climate brought about by distrust of government, lack of accountability and by misuse of government power during the civil rights and Vietnam protest era. Citizen groups such as the League of Women Voters, Common Cause, Washington Coalition for Open Government, and others succeeded in promoting such legislation at a time when conservative opposition to such measures was discredited. Subsequent events of the 1970s, particularly Watergate, vindicated the need for the reform legislation; however, changes in the political climate, increasing sophistication of government agencies and their attorneys, decline of “open government” groups, and public antagonism towards the press led to legislative and judicial retrenchment from the mid-1980s to present, including an increase in the number and scope of exemptions.

The open records law was passed by Washington voters in November 1972 as Initiative 276. The law took effect January 1, 1973. Previously, there was an ill-defined common law right to public records that was seldom litigated.

Note: The open records law was part of the Public Disclosure Act, codified at RCW Ch. 42.17. Effective July 1, 2006, the open records law was re-organized and recodified as RCW Ch. 42.56 and has since been referred to as the Public Records Act.

The major thrust of Initiative 276 was reform of campaign financing and lobbying by requiring disclosure of sources of contributions and expenses. The public records portion of the initiative was a relatively small section and was not the focus of much debate. Since the drafters did not pay extensive attention to the public records section, it is sometimes hard to reconcile how certain sections fit together or what the precise intent is.

The only “legislative history” for Initiative 276 is the State of Washington Voters Pamphlet (November 7, 1972), which contains statements for and against the ballot measure as well as a summary of the proposed law, a summary of the law as it then existed, a summary of the effect the proposed law would have, and the actual text of the new law.

In interpreting the current public records law, appellate judges have cited the Voters Pamphlet as evidence of legislative “intent,” thus giving the Pamphlet some persuasive effect. The Pamphlet described the prior law as follows:

Access to public records is largely governed, under present law, by court decisions under which members of the public having a legitimate interest therein are entitled to examine all records in the custody of a public official which that official is required by law to maintain. However, in the case of records which the official having custody is not required by law to maintain, the disclosure or nondisclosure of information contained therein is largely within the discretion of this official.

(Emphasis added.)

The pamphlet went on to explain that the effect of Initiative 276 was to require disclosure of all public records “regardless of whether or not the particular record is one which the official having custody is required by law to maintain.” The Pamphlet also noted that state and local government agencies would have to meet a number of detailed requirements with respect to the maintenance and indexing of all the records and that public inspection was subject only to certain exceptions relating to “individual rights of privacy or other situations where the act deems the public interest would not best be served by open disclosure.” These statements, and others in the Pamphlet, are usually cited by appellate judges writing pro-disclosure opinions or dissents.

Appellate judges writing pro-disclosure opinions or dissents have also routinely cited the declaration of policy set forth at the beginning of the Act, Rev. Code of Wash. (“RCW”) 42.17.010(11) (now RCW 42.17A.010(11)), which says that “full access to information concerning the conduct of government on every level must be assured as a fundamental and necessary precondition to the sound governance of a free society.”

Subsequently, there have been persistent efforts — some successful, some not — to add exemptions. The press, on the other hand, has been successful in obtaining significant pro-access amendments only on rare occasion. For example, in 1987, a restrictive definition of the “right to privacy” was formally added to the Act after some judicial waffling had created uncertainty with respect to the common law. RCW 42.56.050. In 1992, the Legislature adopted more than a dozen amendments requested by the press, including a broader definition of “public record,” a specific definition of “promptness,” increases in civil penalties, and immunity for public officials who release public records in good faith.

The current Open Public Meetings Act, which was adopted in 1971, has a preamble that is often cited by appellate judges:

The people of this state do not yield their sovereignty to the agencies which serve them. The people, in delegating authority, do not give their public servants the right to decide what is good for the people to know and what is not good for them to know. The people insist on remaining informed so that they may retain control over the instruments they have created.

RCW 42.30.010. The Washington Supreme Court has referred to this preamble as one of the strongest statements of legislative policy contained in any state statute. Cathcart v. Andersen, 85 Wn.2d 102, 107, 530 P.2d 313 (1975). In 1992, the Legislature added this same language to the public records law. RCW 42.56.030.

There is very little legislative history available on most Washington law, including the Open Public Meetings Act. The Washington Legislature seldom maintains a record of floor debates and has nothing comparable to the Congressional Record or the committee reports prepared by the U.S. Congress. At best, there is an occasional colloquy put into the official record for the purpose of clarifying a particular point.

Consequently, the primary “authority” for interpreting the 1971 law is contained in Attorney General Opinion (“AGO”) No. 33 dated October 29, 1971 (and cited as 1971 Op. Atty. Gen. No. 33). This AGO recites the following history to the 1971 Act:

[By enactment of the 1971 Act], the legislature basically replaced our earlier 1953 public meetings act with a comprehensive new act dealing with this subject. This new act was patterned closely after a California statute, commonly referred to as the “Brown Act”; and it is also somewhat similar to an open meetings act which was passed several years ago in Florida . . . .

Before examining the provisions of the new act let us first, for comparative purposes, note the general thrust of the earlier law which it has replaced. Prior to August 9, 1971, when [the new law] became effective, the meetings of public agencies in this state — both state and local — were governed by RCW 42.32.010-.030. The first section of that act required that the adoption of any ordinance, resolution, rule, etc., be done in a meeting open to the public. If the date of that meeting was not fixed by law or rule, then in advance of the meeting there was to be notification to the press, radio and television in the county in which the meeting was to be held. The second section, RCW 42.32.020 specifically permitted the public agency to hold executive sessions and to exclude the public therefrom for all purposes other than “final adoption” of an ordinance, rule, regulation, etc. The third section, RCW 42.32.030, required that minutes be kept of all regular and special meetings, except executive sessions, and further required that those records be open for public inspection [this section continues to remain in effect].

Under this prior legislation it was quite possible for a public agency to take all the preliminary steps toward action, save only the final act of formal adoption of the rule or other directive, in sessions which were closed to the public. It is important that this be understood, because a legislature which enacts a new law such as that we are here considering must be presumed to have been aware of the scope and effect of its prior law on the subject and have intended to accomplish change therein.

The Open Public Meetings Act has been the subject of far less court interpretation and legislative revision than the Public Records Act. In part, this may be due to its clearer language and history. It also may reflect the OPMA’s comparatively weak remedies, which limit the incentives to pursue open-meeting violations.COMPARE

Open Records

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I. Statute

Note: Pursuant to RCW 42.56.570, the Washington Attorney General’s Office (AGO) has prepared a set of model rules regarding the Public Records Act. See WAC Ch. 44-14. Each state and local agency is urged to adopt these rules to provide greater clarity and uniformity in terms of how public records requests are handled. The original model rules, adopted in 2006, indirectly provided a good overview regarding interpretation of the Public Records Act and a guide to agency “best practices.” The rules were revised and, to some extent, watered down, in 2018. COMPARE

A. Who can request records?

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1. Status of requester

Any person may request records. RCW 42.56.080. “Person” includes an individual, public, private or governmental entity, or “any other organization or group of persons, however organized.” RCW 42.17.020(35) (2000). A requester does not have to establish a “need to know” in order to obtain access. RCW 42.56.080; Yacobellis v. City of Bellingham, 55 Wn. App. 706, 780 P.2d 272 (1989), pet. for review denied, 114 Wn.2d 1002, 788 P.2d 1077 (1990).

Per a 2017 amendment, an agency may deny “bot requests,” which are defined as request “for public records that an agency reasonably believes was automatically generated by a computer program or script” received multiple times in a 24-hour period, where “responding to the multiple requests would cause excessive interference with other essential functions of the agency.” RCW 42.56.080(3).COMPARE

2. Purpose of request

The Public Records Act contains a few restrictions based on the requester’s purpose: (1) Agencies may not sell or provide access to lists of individuals requested for commercial purposes. RCW 42.56.070(9). This prohibition applies to requests by commercial entities such as bill collectors or process servers, but not by governmental entities such as county sheriffs, the State Patrol, or a television reception improvement district not engaged in any “profit expecting” business activity. 1983 Op. Atty. Gen. No. 9. It is universally agreed that a newspaper, engaging in newsgathering, is not affected by this exemption. (2) Imprisoned criminals may be enjoined from obtaining otherwise disclosable records, if it is shown that the request was made to harass or intimidate a public agency or employee or to assist criminal activity, or would threaten the security of a correctional facility or any person. RCW 42.56.565. (3) Certain requesters are exempt from a statutory provision that generally allows law enforcement agencies to charge requesters the costs incurred in redacting exempt material from police body worn camera footage. The exemption applies to persons directly involved in the incident depicted; specific state minority affairs commissions; and attorneys pursuing civil rights claims. RCW 42.56.240(14)(e). (4) Under a 2017 amendment to the PRA, a request “for all or substantially all” of an agency’s records is not considered a valid request for identifiable records. RCW 42.56.080(1).COMPARE

3. Use of records

There are no other restrictions on subsequent use of information provided.COMPARE

4. Can an individual request records on behalf of a third party or organization?

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B. Whose records are and are not subject to the Act

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1. Executive branch

The Public Records Act applies to all state and local agencies. RCW 42.56.040, .070(1). There is no express statutory or case law concerning access to executives themselves, but the definition of “agency” appears broad enough to cover them. Relying on “separation of powers” concerns, the state supreme court has held that a qualified gubernatorial communications privilege is an exemption to the PRA.  Freedom Found. v. Gregoire, 178 Wn.2d 686, 310 P.3d 1252 (2013). In practice, the governor can waive this executive privilegeCOMPARE

2. Legislative bodies

The Public Records Act applies to administrative records of the Clerk of the State House of Representatives and of the Secretary of the Senate. RCW 42.56.100. In 2019, the Washington Supreme Court held that individual state legislators’ offices are “agencies” under the PRA, but that the full House and Senate were not. Associated Press v. Wash. State Legislature, 194 Wn.2d 915, 454 P.3d 93 (2019).COMPARE

3. Courts

Records of the Judicial Qualification Commission are exempt. Garner v. Cherberg, 111 Wn.2d 811, 765 P.2d 1284 (1988). The Washington State Supreme Court has held that court case files are not subject to the Public Records Act. Nast v. Michaels, 107 Wn.2d 300, 730 P.2d 54 (1986). Subsequent cases have extended this rule to all records held by the judicial branch, including administrative documents and correspondence. Fed. Way v. Koenig, 167 Wn.2d 341, 217 P.3d 1172 (2009). Effective in 2016, the Washington Supreme Court adopted a rule (GR 31.1) that provides a presumption of access to such records, subject to all of the exemptions contained in the Public Records Act, as well as additional specific exemptions and a privacy-based “balancing test.”COMPARE

4. Nongovernmental bodies

Private entities generally are not subject to the Public Records Act, except in rare circumstances where they are found to be the “functional equivalent” of a public agency. Courts apply a fact-specific four-part test (which also applies under the OPMA) that looks to (1) whether the entity performs a governmental function; (2) the level of government funding; (3) the extent of government involvement or regulation; and (4) whether the entity was created by the government. See Fortgang v. Woodland Park Zoo, 187 Wn.2d 509, 387 P.3d 690 (2017); Cedar Grove Composting, Inc. v. City of Marysville, 188 Wn. App. 695, 354 P.3d 249 (2015); Clarke v. Tri-Cities Animal Care & Control Shelter, 144 Wn. App. 185, 181 P.3d 881 (2008); Telford v. Thurston Cnty. Bd. of Comm’rs, 95 Wn. App. 149, 974 P.2d 886 (1999).

Certain records of the Washington State Bar Association are publicly available, under a rule adopted by the Washington Supreme Court in 2014.  See GR 12.4. The rule incorporates the exemptions of the PRA, and also exempts from disclosure bar admission and disciplinary records, among other things.COMPARE

5. Multi-state or regional bodies

Such bodies arguably fall within the legislative purpose of the Act. In Worthington v. Westnet, 182 Wn.2d 500, 341 P.3d 995 (2015), the state supreme court held that a regional drug enforcement task force could not, by interlocal agreement, declare itself to be outside the reach of the Public Records Act, and that the court should look to the body’s actual operational structure to determine whether it was an “agency” under the statute. There is special language in the Open Public Meetings Act for regional bodies of publicly owned utilities “formed by or pursuant to” Washington law. RCW 42.30.020(1)(d).COMPARE

6. Advisory boards and commissions, quasi-governmental entities

Such entities fall within the broad definition of “agency” under the Act. RCW 42.56.010(1).COMPARE

7. Others

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C. What records are and are not subject to the act?

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1. What kinds of records are covered?

The Act applies to all “public records,” defined as any record “relating to the conduct of government or the performance of any governmental or proprietary function prepared, owned, used, or retained by any state or local agency regardless of physical form or characteristics.” RCW 42.56.010. Courts have interpreted this broadly. For example, records regarding “community contributions” from Native American tribes to the State Gambling Commission are public records, because the Commission relies on those documents when negotiating compacts with the tribes.  Confederated Tribes of Chehalis Reservation v. Johnson, 135 Wn.2d 734, 958 P.2d 260 (1998). In Concerned Ratepayers Association v. Public Utility District No. 1, 138 Wn.2d 950, 983 P.2d 635 (1999), the court found that an agency “used” a record that it had examined at the vendor’s site and subsequently cited in a feasibility study. Electronic “metadata” is disclosable as a public record if the metadata is specifically requested. O’Neill v. Shoreline, 170 Wn.2d 138, 240 P.3d 1149 (2010). The Act does not apply to requests for information rather than records. See Smith v. Okanogan Cnty., 100 Wn. App. 7, 994 P.2d 857 (2000); Bonamy v. City of Seattle, 92 Wn. App. 403, 994 P.2d 857 (1998).COMPARE

2. What physical form of records are covered

The term “records” includes any document, film, tape, recording, computer record, etc. RCW 42.56.010(3)–(4) (eff. Jan. 1, 2012). The Act does not require agencies to create records that do not exist. See Smith v. Okanogan Cnty., 100 Wn. App. 7, 994 P.2d 857 (2000).COMPARE

3. Are certain records available for inspection but not copying?

The statute does not distinguish between records available for inspection and records available for copying. But see Hudgens v. City of Renton, 49 Wn. App. 842, 746 P.2d 320 (1987) (noting that the Criminal Records Privacy Act exempts nonconviction data from copying provisions of the Public Records Act but not inspection provisions), review denied, 110 Wn.2d 1014 (1988). Agencies are permitted to adopt and enforce rules to protect records from damage or disorganization, or to prevent excessive interference with other essential agency functions. RCW 42.56.100.COMPARE

4. Telephone call logs

In Nissen v. Pierce County, 183 Wn.2d 863, 357 P.3d 45 (2015), the Washington Supreme Court held call logs prepared and retained by a third-party telecommunications company were not “public records,” even though they showed a public employee’s telephone usage.  An appellate court held that Internet access logs held by a county, showing public employees’ internet activities were public records, but the state supreme court reversed that decision on statute of limitations grounds.  Belenski v. Jefferson Cnty., 187 Wn. App. 724, 350 P.3d 689 (2015), rev’d on other grounds 186 Wn.2d 452, 378 P.3d 176 (2016).COMPARE

5. Electronic records (e.g., databases, metadata)

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a. Can the requester choose a format for receiving records?

Washington law defines “public record” broadly to include electronic formats. RCW 42.56.010. There is no provision in the Act permitting agencies to limit the format in which public records may be examined or copied. Consequently, the requester can choose any available format for receiving the records. Although the PRA does not expressly require an agency to provide unredacted e-mails in an electronic format, an agency must do so where reasonable and feasible, under the PRA’s “fullest assistance” provision (RCW 42.56.100). Mechling v. Monroe, 152 Wn. App. 830, 222 P.3d 808 (2009).COMPARE

b. Can the requester obtain a customized search of computer databases to fit particular needs

Yes, under a statute passed in 2017 that also allows the agency to charge a fee for such customized services. RCW 42.56.120(3).COMPARE

c. Does the existence of information in electronic format affect its openness?

Nothing in the Washington statute suggests that the existence of information in the electronic form affects its openness. In fact, the opposite is true: electronic records fit within the definition of “records.” RCW 42.56.010.COMPARE

d. Online dissemination

The PRA provides that an agency may respond to a record request by providing a link to the requested record on the agency’s website (unless the requester lacks internet access, in which case the agency must provide a hard copy). RCW 42.56.520.COMPARE

6. Email

Emails held by public agencies are public records.COMPARE

7. Text messages and other electronic messages

Text messages that otherwise fall within the definition of “public records” are subject to disclosure under the PRA, even if they are held on a public employee’s personal device. Nissen v. Pierce Cnty., 183 Wn.2d 863, 357 P.3d 45 (2015).COMPARE

8. Social media posts

There is no statute or case law specifically addressing this issue.COMPARE

9. Computer software

There is no statute or case law specifically addressing this issue.COMPARE

10. Can a requester ask for the creation or compilation of a new record?

The PRA does not require an agency to create new records that do not already exist. An agency may respond to requests by providing customized access to existing databases, though it may assess fees (which must be disclosed in advance) if doing so requires use of data services not used by the agency for other agency purposes. RCW 42.56.120(3).COMPARE

D. Fee provisions

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1. Types of assessable fees (e.g., for search, review, duplication) and levels or limitations on fees

No fees may be charged merely for inspection or locating of public records, other than for certain customized requests. RCW 42.56.120. An agency may impose a reasonable charge for providing copies “which . . . shall not exceed the amount necessary to reimburse the agency . . . for its actual costs directly incident to such copying.” Id.COMPARE

2. Particular fee specifications or provisions

For photocopies, the default rate is fifteen cents per page. RCW 42.56.120. Agencies may charge ten cents per page for scanning records into an electronic format, and five cents for each four electronic files or attachment uploaded to email, cloud-based data storage service, or other means of electronic delivery.  RCW 42.56.120. Agencies may charge higher rates, but only if they establish that a higher rate is necessary to recover actual costs and the basis for computation of the charge. RCW 42.56.070(7). Alternatively, an agency may charge a flat fee of up to two dollars for any request. RCW 42.56.120. The Act sets forth criteria which may be considered in determining such cost. Id.; see also RCW 70.58.107 (2000) (regarding birth, death, marriage, and dissolution certificates).

Search fees may not be charged to requesters under the Public Records Act, except for customized requests, and then only if the fees are discussed and agreed to in advance. RCW 42.56.120.COMPARE

3. Provisions for fee waivers

As a practical matter, many agencies do not charge for small quantities of records in order to avoid the administrative time and expense of collecting and accounting for small fees. An agency may waive any charge assessed for a request, if the agency has adopted a rule so providing. RCW 42.56.120(4).COMPARE

4. Requirements or prohibitions regarding advance payment

An agency may require a deposit in an amount not to exceed 10% of the estimated cost of providing copies for a request. RCW 42.56.120. If an agency makes records available in installments, the agency may charge for each part of the request as it is provided. Id.COMPARE

5. Have agencies imposed prohibitive fees to discourage requesters?

Anecdotally, some counties have considered imposing what have been viewed as prohibitively high fees, but the media have successfully prevailed upon these counties not to follow through with the proposals.COMPARE

6. Fees for electronic records

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E. Who enforces the Act?

The Public Records Act is generally enforced through private litigation. Any person who has been refused to allow inspection or copying of public records may demand judicial review through a civil lawsuit. RCW 42.56.550. Likewise, any person who believes that an agency has not provided a reasonable estimate of time that the agency requires to respond to a public records request may seek judicial review. Id. Alternatively, if a state agency denies a person an opportunity to inspect or copy a public record, the individual may request the attorney general’s office to review the matter and provide a written opinion. RCW 42.56.530. Such opinions are not binding on the agency, but may be persuasive.

An agency, or a third party named in or referred to in a record, is entitled to seek a court order enjoining the inspection of a public record. RCW 42.56.540; Dawson v. Daly, 120 Wn.2d 782, 845 P.2d 995 (1993). To obtain such an order, the agency or third party must establish not only that a specific exemption applies, but also that disclosure (1) clearly would not be in the public interest, and (2) would substantially and irreparably damage a person or a vital government interest. RCW 42.56.540; Lyft, Inc. v. City of Seattle, 190 Wn.2d 769, 773, 418 P.3d 102, 104 (2018).

An agency, or a third party named in or referred to in a record, is entitled to seek a court order enjoining the inspection of a public record. RCW 42.56.540. Dawson v. Daly, 120 Wn.2d 782, 845 P.2d 995 (1993).COMPARE

1. Attorney General’s role

If a state agency denies a person an opportunity to inspect or copy a public record, the individual may request the attorney general’s office to review the matter and provide a written opinion. RCW 42.56.530. Such opinions are not binding on an agency or a court but may be persuasive.COMPARE

2. Availability of an ombudsman

There is no ombudsperson provision in the Public Records Act. The Washington Attorney General’s Office has an “open government ombudsman,” who is available to consult on and assist with public records and open meetings issues. http://www.atg.wa.gov/OpenGovernment/Ombudsman.aspx.COMPARE

3. Commission or agency enforcement

There is no commission or agency that enforces the Public Records Act. The state Public Disclosure Commission only enforces the campaign finance disclosure aspects of the Public Disclosure Act. RCW 42.17.350, .360, .390.COMPARE

F. Are there sanctions for noncompliance?

A requester who prevails against an agency that has denied a record must be awarded their costs, including reasonable attorneys’ fees. RCW 42.56.505(4). In addition, the court must award civil penalties in an amount not to exceed $100 per day for each day that the requester was denied the right to inspect or copy a public record. Id. The factors courts apply in determining the amount of such awards are set out in Yousoufian v. Office of Ron Sims, 168 Wn.2d 444, 229 P.3d 735 (2010).COMPARE

G. Record-holder obligations

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1. Search obligations

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2. Proactive disclosure requirements

Agencies are not required to proactively post or release public records, but are not permitted to charge for records that they routinely post on their websites.  RCW 42.56.120.COMPARE

3. Records retention requirements

Public agencies must retain public records in accordance with RCW 40.14.060 and retention schedules approved by the Secretary of State’s Office. Intentional destruction of public records in violation of the retention requirements is a felony. RCW 40.16.010.COMPARE

4. Provisions for broad, vague, or burdensome requests

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A. Exemptions in the open records statute

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1. Character of exemptions

Under case law, the coverage of the Act is liberally construed and its exemptions narrowly confined. RCW 42.56.030. Disclosure is required unless a specific exemption applies.  RCW 42.56.070.

The exemptions in the Public Records Act are permissive, not mandatory. Thus, an agency can release information even if an exemption applies.

Washington courts will sometimes look to federal FOIA case law when interpreting the Public Records Act. Dawson v. Daly, 120 Wn.2d 782, 791, 845 P.2d 995 (1993). The exemptions are only loosely patterned after the federal act, and in some cases the two statutes are “markedly different.” Laborers Int’l Union v. City of Aberdeen, 31 Wn. App. 445, 448, 642 P.2d 418 (1982).COMPARE

2. Discussion of each exemption

a. Clients of the State. This exemption permits nondisclosure of personal information “in any files maintained for students in public schools, patients or clients of public institutions or public health agencies, or welfare recipients.” RCW 42.56.230(1). The exemption is limited to information maintained in the collection of individual client files that the agency necessarily maintains for the client. Lindeman v. Kelso Sch. Dist., 162 Wn.2d 196, 172 P.3d 329 (2007).

The names and addresses of property owners who contract with the city for federal HUD loans are not “clients” of the city, nor are their names and addresses “personal information” under the exemption. Walla Walla Union-Bulletin v. Walla Walla City Council, 7 Med. L. Rptr. 1858 (Walla Walla Cty. July 14, 1981).

Personal information of children and family members enrolled in certain childcare and recreational services is exempt from disclosure. RCW 42.56.230(2).

b. Employees. The statute permits nondisclosure of personal information about public officials and employees “to the extent that disclosure would violate their right to privacy.” RCW 42.56.230(3). The “right to privacy” refers to matters that would be highly offensive to a reasonable person if disclosed and are not of public concern. RCW 42.56.050; Hearst Corp. v. Hoppe, 90 Wn.2d 123, 580 P.2d 246 (1978). Agencies must prove both prongs of the test and cannot balance the public interest against the privacy interest. See Tacoma Pub. Library v. Woessner, 90 Wn. App. 357, 951 P.2d 357 (1998). Disclosure of the mere fact that a public employer is investigating a public employee, or that the employee is on administrative leave, does not violate the employee’s right to privacy. Predisik v. Spokane Sch. Dist. No. 81, 182 Wn.2d 896, 346 P.3d 737 (2015). Release of records related to teacher certification revocations, particularly as they pertain to teachers’ sexual misconduct with students, does not violate the teachers’ right to privacy. Brouillet v. Cowles Publ’g Co., 114 Wn.2d 788, 791 P.2d 526 (1990). However, disclosure of the identity of a teacher accused of sexual misconduct violates the teacher’s right to privacy under the statute if the allegation is not substantiated. Bellevue John Does 1-11 v. Bellevue Sch. Dist. #405, 164 Wn.2d 199, 189 P.3d 139 (2008).

The exemption does not cover police officer complaints about their police chief’s job performance. Columbian Publ’g Co. v. City of Vancouver, 36 Wn. App. 25, 671 P.2d 280 (1983). A discharged school employee can obtain performance evaluations of other employees; however, the names of coworkers will be redacted unless there is a specific showing that the right to privacy should not apply. Ollie v. Highland Sch. Dist., 50 Wn. App. 639, 749 P.2d 757, review denied, 110 Wn.2d 1040 (1988). Disclosure of performance evaluations, which do not discuss any specific instances of misconduct or the performance of public duties, is presumptively highly offensive to a reasonable person and not of legitimate public concern, and thus violative of the employee’s privacy rights and exempt. Dawson v. Daly, 120 Wn.2d 782, 797, 845 P.2d 995 (1993). Beltran v. DSHS, 98 Wn. App. 245, 989 P.2d 604. However, evaluations of high level employees, such as a city manager or high-ranking police official, have more significant public interest and are not exempt under DawsonSee Spokane Research v. City of Spokane, 99 Wn. App. 452, 994 P.2d 267 (2000); City of Fife v. Hicks, 186 Wn. App. 122, 345 P.3d 1 (2015).

The legitimacy of public concern is determined by balancing the public’s interest in disclosure against the public’s interest in the efficient administration of government.  Thus, the public has a legitimate concern in seeing a settlement agreement between a city and one of its top employees because “[t]he fact a public body may not be able to keep the specific terms of a settlement agreement confidential does not have such a chilling effect on future settlements so as to affect the efficient administration of government.” Yakima Newspapers, Inc. v. City of Yakima, 77 Wn. App. 319, 328, 890 P.2d 544 (1995).

The state Attorney General has stated that public employee salary information is generally not personal information which may be withheld, although individual employee deductions may be protected by a right to privacy. 1973 Op. Atty. Gen. No. 4. Employee identification numbers are exempt, but names must be released. See Tacoma Pub. Library v. Woessner, 90 Wn. App. 357, 951 P.2d 357 (1998). Information provided by job applicants for a city plumber’s job, however, including reasons for leaving the previous job, criminal convictions and handicaps, may be withheld. Wash. State Human Rights Comm’n v. City of Seattle, 25 Wn. App. 364, 607 P.2d 332 (1980). In 1987, the legislature exempted all applications for public employment, including resumes and names included in those applications. RCW 42.56.250(2). The courts also have held that applications are exempt under RCW 42.56.210(1)(b). Beltran v. DSHS, 98 Wn. App. 245, 989 P.2d 604 (1999).

In addition, residential addresses, telephone numbers, personal email addresses and other specific personal information of public employees or volunteers may be withheld from public disclosure. RCW 42.56.250(4). This exemption applies only to records held in personnel files and public employment records. Thus, a public official’s personal email address is not exempt if it appears in other types of public records. Mechling v. Monroe, 152 Wn. App. 830, 222 P.3d 808 (2009).

The Washington Supreme Court has held that the state constitutional right of privacy does not apply to prevent disclosure of public records containing public employees’ dates of birth in connection with their full name. Wash. Pub. Emps. Ass’n v. Wash. State Ctr. for Childhood Deafness & Hearing Loss, 194 Wn.2d 484, 450 P.3d 601 (2019).

Public employees who seek advice under an agency process concerning unfair labor practices, or use internal, informal anti-discrimination procedures, have the right to remain anonymous. RCW 42.56.250(5)–(6).

Also exempt are criminal history records checks for certain board staff finalist candidates. RCW 42.56.250(7).

Photographs and birthdates of criminal justice agency employees are exempt from disclosure. This exemption does not apply to the news media. RCW 42.56.250(8).

GPS data that would indicate the location of a public employee’s or volunteer’s residence is exempt from disclosure.  RCW 42.56.250(10).

Also exempt is voluntarily submitted personal demographic information (including race, ethnicity and sexual orientation) collected by a state agency or higher education institution, though aggregated information is subject to disclosure. RCW 42.56.250(11). Even if a court orders release of documents, an employee or other person may sue the agency for common law invasion of privacy. See Corbally v. Kennewick Sch. Dist., 94 Wn. App. 736, 973 P.2d 1074 (1999). But see Corey v. Pierce Cnty., 154 Wn. App. 752, 766, 225 P.3d 367 (2010) (ruling dismissed employee’s claim for “negligent dissemination of harmful information” was barred as a matter of law). The mere fact that records may not be disclosable under a PRA privacy-based exemption does not in itself give rise to an invasion of privacy action against media entities that report the information contained in the record. See Cawley-Herrmann v. Meredith Corp., 654 F.Supp.2d 1264 (W.D. Wash. 2009).

c. Taxpayer, Financial and Personal License Information. Tax returns, and information that would result in unfair competitive disadvantage to the taxpayer or violate the taxpayer’s right to privacy, are generally exempt. RCW 42.56.230(4). The “right to privacy” refers to matters that would be highly offensive to a reasonable person if disclosed and are not of public concern. RCW 42.56.050; Hearst Corp. v. Hoppe, 90 Wn.2d 123, 580 P.2d 246 (1978). Credit/debit card numbers and other financial account numbers are also exempt. RCW 42.56.230(4)–(5). Personal information contained in documents used to apply for a driver’s license or identicard is exempt under RCW 42.56.230(6).

d. Investigative Records. This exemption applies to specific investigative records, the nondisclosure of which is essential to law enforcement or to protect a person’s right to privacy. RCW 42.56.240(1). Reports generated as part of routine administrative procedure, not as the result of a specific complaint or allegation of misconduct, are not “investigative reports.” Cowles Publ’g Co. v. City of Spokane, 69 Wn. App. 678, 683, 849 P.2d 1271 (noting that police reports regarding contact by any K-9 dog with citizen, generated as matter of course, are not investigative records), review denied, 122 Wn.2d 1013, 863 P.2d 73 (1993); Wade’s Eastside Gun Shop, Inc. v. Dep’t of Labor & Indus., 185 Wn.2d 270, 372 P.3d 97 (2016) (noting that a workplace safety investigation does not implicate this exemption). Reports which could trigger an investigation and imposition of sanctions if warranted, but which are not themselves used for “law enforcement,” are not exempt. Id. at 684.

Investigative records related to pending criminal matters are presumptively subject to disclosure once a suspect has been arrested and referred to the prosecutor for a charging decision.  Seattle Times Co. v. Serko, 170 Wn.2d 581, 243 P.3d 919 (2010); Cowles Publ’g Co. v. Spokane Police Dep’t, 139 Wn.2d 472, 987 P.2d 620 (1999). The state supreme court at one point created a categorical exemption for “open and active” police investigation files in which disclosure would jeopardize the ability to solve the case. Newman v. King Cnty., 133 Wn.2d 565, 947 P.2d 712 (1997). The court later clarified that the categorical exemption only exists for “information contained in an open, active police investigation file.” Limstrom v. Ladenburg, 136 Wn.2d 595, 963 P.2d 869 (1998) (refusing to extend a categorical exemption to work product materials under RCW 42.56.290). In Cowles and again in Serko, the court further clarified that the concept of categorical exemption did not apply once the case was referred to the prosecutor’s office, even if the files remained technically open. See also Sargent v. Seattle Police Dep’t, 179 Wn.2d 376, 314 P.3d 1093 (2013).

The “right to privacy” refers to matters that would be highly offensive to a reasonable person if disclosed and are not of public concern. RCW 42.56.050; Hearst, 90 Wn.2d at 137–38. In a torturous opinion, a Washington court held that whether statements in public records are “true” bears on whether the records are of legitimate concern to the public. City of Tacoma v. Tacoma News, Inc., 65 Wn. App. 140, 827 P.2d 1094, review denied, 119 Wn.2d 1020, 838 P.2d 692 (1992) (ruling police records of investigation based on unsubstantiated allegation of child abuse against political candidate were not of legitimate public concern). But see Hudgens v. City of Renton, 49 Wn. App. 842, 746 P.2d 320 (1987) (ruling that arrest report, citation, and patrol report must be disclosed despite acquittal), review denied, 110 Wn.2d 1014 (1988). In Bellevue John Does 1-11 v. Bellevue School District #405, 164 Wn.2d 199, 189 P.3d 139 (2008), the Washington Supreme Court held that the identities of teachers accused of sexual misconduct are not subject to disclosure in cases where the allegations were not substantiated.

Police body worn camera recordings are subject to disclosure except to the extent necessary to protect a person’s “right to privacy,” under a modified version of the privacy test discussed above. Certain types of recordings are presumed to be “highly offensive,” including depictions showing the inside of medical facilities and residences, intimate images, minors and the body of a deceased person. RCW 42.56.240(14).  Public records requests for bodycam footage must also specify a particular individual involved in an incident, a specific officer, or the incident’s time and location. Id.

Criminal records on charges that have not resulted in conviction or other adverse disposition and for which formal proceedings are over are closed to the public. RCW 10.97.050; id. 10.97.030(2). Internal police investigations are considered exempt, even though no criminal charges are involved and no right to privacy is violated. The Washington Supreme Court has said that public disclosure of such investigations would render law enforcement ineffective. Cowles Publ’g Co. v. State Patrol, 109 Wn.2d 712, 748 P.2d 597. Nevertheless, an investigative report concerning liquor law violations at a police guild party is not exempt on grounds that public disclosure would render law enforcement ineffective or violate the officers’ privacy. Spokane Police Guild v. Liquor Control Bd., 112 Wn.2d 30, 769 P.2d 283. In addition, internal investigation records are not exempt if requested as part of the discovery process, because a trial court can craft a protective order to alleviate law enforcement concerns. State v. Jones, 96 Wn. App. 369, 979 P.2d 898 (1999).

e. Identity of Witnesses, Victims, and Persons Filing Complaints. The identity of witnesses, victims, and persons who file criminal or quasi-criminal complaints with agencies other than the Public Disclosure Commission if the complainant indicates at the time of filing the complaint that the complainant desires for it to be confidential, is exempt if disclosure would endanger a person’s life, property or physical safety. RCW 42.56.240(2).

Information revealing the identity of child victims of sexual assault who are under age 18 is confidential. RCW 42.56.240(5).

f. Other crime/law enforcement records. License applications for concealed pistols are exempt from public disclosure. RCW 42.56.240(4). The felony firearm offense conviction database is exempt under RCW 42.56.240(10).

The statewide gang database is exempt from disclosure. RCW 42.45.240(6).

Data from the state pseudoephedrine sales tracking system is exempt from disclosure.  RCW 42.56.240(7).

Identifying information submitted to the statewide unified sex offender notification and registration program for the purpose of receiving notification regarding a registered sex offender is exempt from disclosure.  RCW 42.56.240(8).

Personally identifying information collected by law enforcement from local security alarm system and crime watch programs is exempt from disclosure. RCW 42.56.240(9).

g. Test Questions. An agency may withhold “[t]est questions, scoring keys, and other examination data used to administer a license, employment, or academic examination.” RCW 42.56.250(1).

h. Real Estate Appraisals. Real estate appraisals made in connection with the purchase or sale of property are exempt from disclosure until the earlier of (1) three years from the date of the appraisal or (2) consummation or abandonment of the transaction. RCW 42.56.260.

i. Commercially Valuable Information. An agency may withhold any valuable formulae, designs, drawings or research data obtained within five years of the request for disclosure if disclosure would produce private gain and public loss. RCW 42.56.270(1). “Research data” is defined as “a body of facts and information collected for a specific purpose and derived from close, careful study, or from scholarly or scientific investigation or inquiry.” Servais v. Port of Bellingham, 127 Wn.2d 820, 832, 904 P.2d 1124 (1995) (holding that cash flow report prepared for Port’s use in negotiations with developers was exempt). Research data includes raw data and the guiding hypotheses that structure the data, Progressive Animal Welfare Soc’y v. Univ. of Wash., 125 Wn.2d 243, 255, 884 P.2d 592 (1994), and is not limited to scientific facts. Servais, 127 Wn.2d at 831. The exemption does not cover accounting reports developed to secure a federal loan. See Spokane Research v. City of Spokane, 96 Wn. App. 569, 994 P.2d 267 (1999).

RCW 42.56.270, which is frequently amended and updated, sets out a number of additional specific exemptions related to financial or proprietary information held by specified state boards and agencies, including certain information submitted by bidders in connection with highway or ferry system construction; loan information held by state sponsored development programs; certain private commercial information supplied to state sponsored export services and industrial development corporations, and the state Investment Board; and financial information provided by health care providers for workers compensation programs.

j. Deliberative Process. This exemption allows nondisclosure of intra-agency deliberative materials. RCW 42.56.280. Inter-agency materials are not exempt. Columbian Publ’g Co. v. City of Vancouver, 36 Wn. App. 25, 671 P.2d 280 (1983). The exemption applies to opinions, such as faculty tenure evaluations, Hafermehl v. Univ. of Wash., 29 Wn. App. 366, 628 P.2d 846 (1981), but does not include purely factual matters, Hearst Corp. v. Hoppe, 90 Wn.2d 123, 580 P.2d 246 (1978), or the raw data on which a decision is based. PAWS, 125 Wn.2d at 256. Deliberative materials are exempt only until the policies or recommendations contained in such records are implemented. Dawson v. Daly, 120 Wn.2d 782, 793, 845 P.2d 995 (1993).

k. Discovery Exemption. If an agency is a party to a lawsuit, it may withhold any records relevant to that suit that would be protected under rules of pretrial discovery. RCW 42.56.290. Civil, rather than criminal, discovery rules apply. Limstrom v. Ladenburg, 136 Wn.2d 595, 963 P.2d 869 (1998). This exemption applies to “reasonably anticipated litigation,” id. at 791, and to records created to evaluate an agency’s potential liability, Overlake Fund v. City of Bellevue, 70 Wn. App. 789, 794, 855 P.2d 706 (1993), review denied, 123 Wn.2d 1009, 869 P.2d 1084 (1994), but it does not apply where the records may only have some possible relevance to a future hypothetical dispute with a third party. Yakima Newspapers, Inc. v. City of Yakima, 77 Wn. App. 319, 325, 890 P.2d 544 (1995). As reflected in the work product rule, the exemption also applies after the termination of litigation. Dawson, 120 Wn.2d at 790. A settlement agreement is not protected under the work product rule and, thus, this exemption, because it is not prepared in anticipation of litigation but in an attempt to conclude litigation. Yakima Newspapers, 77 Wn. App. at 326-27. The courts have refused to create a blanket work product exemption to everything in a prosecutor’s litigation file. Limstrom v. Ladenburg, 136 Wn.2d 595, 963 P.2d 869 (1998). But see Koenig v. Pierce Cnty., 151 Wn. App. 221, 211 P.3d 423 (2009) (exempting transcript of a witness statement under work product exemption because it was sought by the prosecutor in anticipation of litigation).  In Seattle Times Co. v. Serko, 170 Wn.2d 581, 243 P.3d 919 (2010), the Washington Supreme Court held that police investigative records generally are not exempt from PRA disclosure as prosecutorial work product.  The court expressly rejected the argument that “a law enforcement agency is merely an arm of the prosecutor’s office for purposes of a work product analysis.”

In Morgan v. Federal Way, 166 Wn.2d 747, 213 P.3d 596 (2009), the Washington Supreme Court held that a city’s report investigating a hostile work environment complaint against a municipal judge was subject to disclosure, and did not qualify as work product because at the time of the investigation, no litigation had been threatened or anticipated.

l. Archaeological Site Protection. Records identifying the location of archaeological sites may be withheld to avoid looting or degradation of sites. RCW 42.56.300.

m. Library Records. Library records that are used primarily to maintain control of library materials may be withheld to protect the identity of the user. RCW 42.56.310.

n. Schools. Certain financial disclosures that private vocational schools must file by law may be withheld from public disclosure. RCW 42.56.320(1). Any state college, library or archive that receives a gift or grant which by its terms restricts public access to certain records may withhold such records. RCW 42.56.320(4). RCW 42.56.315, enacted in 2020, exempts a range of records shared among school districts regarding notification of past offenses by transferred students. RCW 42.56.375 exempts records identifying witnesses and victims of sexual misconduct in postsecondary educational institutions.

o. Utilities and Transportation Records. Certain records filed with the state Utilities and Transportation Commission that a court has determined are confidential are exempt. RCW 42.56.330(1).

p. Utility and Transit Customers. Residential addresses and telephone numbers of customers of a public utility may be withheld from public disclosure. Personal records related to carpool programs, transit passes, toll transponders and the like are also exempt. RCW 42.56.330(2)-(9).

q. Timeshare Condominiums. Membership lists in timeshare projects that must be filed by law may be withheld from public disclosure. RCW 42.56.340.

r. Health Care Providers. The Social Security numbers, residential addresses, and phone numbers of health care providers may be withheld from disclosure. RCW 42.56.350. Records obtained from or on behalf of HMOs, entities providing disability insurance or health care services, pharmaceutical manufacturers, or other entities which purchase, dispense or distribute drugs may be withheld. RCW 42.56.360(1)(b). Also, records created for and maintained by a heath care provider’s quality improvement committee are exempt. RCW 42.56.360(1)(c).

s. Domestic Violence. Client records maintained by a domestic violence shelter or rape crisis center are exempt. RCW 42.56.370.

t. Agricultural Information. Business information related to organic food product certification is protected from public inspection and copying. RCW 42.56.380(1). Other exemptions for personal and business information submitted in connection with specified agricultural programs are set out in RCW 42.56.380.

u. Medical Records. Health care information of patients is exempt except for certain directory information. RCW 42.56.360(2); RCW 70.02.

v. Check Casher/Seller. Residential addresses, telephone numbers, and financial statements in applications for check casher/seller licensing are exempt. RCW 42.56.450.

w. Impaired Physicians. Certain records involving disciplinary action under the impaired physicians program may be withheld from public disclosure. RCW 42.56.360(1)(e).

x. Life Insurance Policy Holders. Names and identifying information of owners of life insurance policies regulated by the insurance commissioner are exempt. RCW 42.56.400(3). Other exemptions applicable to insurance and financial institutions are set out in RCW 42.56.400.

y. Fireworks Records. Records produced pursuant to the state Fireworks Law are exempt from disclosure. RCW 42.56.460.

z. Security. Portions of records assembled, prepared or maintained to prevent or respond to criminal terrorist acts and specific and unique vulnerability assessments are exempt from disclosure. RCW 42.56.420(1). Also, records obtained as a result of national security briefings with state and local government are not subject to disclosure when they are not subject to disclosure under federal law. Id.; see also Nw. Gas Ass’n v. Wash. Utils. & Transp. Commn, 141 Wn. App. 98, 168 P.3d 443 (2007). Other information regarding security jails, schools, communications networks, and transportation system may be exempt. RCW 42.56.420(2)-(6).

aa.  Fish and Wildlife. Specified commercial and recreational fish and wildlife data are exempt under RCW 42.56.430.COMPARE

B. Other statutory exclusions

The Public Records Act also exempts from disclosure any record for which disclosure is prohibited by another statute. RCW 42.56.070(1). There are dozens of such “other statutes” under state and federal law. Examples include:

  1. Criminal Records Privacy Act. The Act restricts access to pre-conviction and nonconviction records generally but not post-conviction records. Records of entry are accessible on a chronological basis, and records of those currently in the criminal justice system are not exempt. RCW 10.97.
  2. Juvenile Records. Juvenile offender hearings are presumed open (but may be judicially closed for good cause). RCW 13.40.140(6); 13.50.010; id. 13.50.050(2), (11). Juvenile dependency hearings and records, on the other hand, are presumptively closed. RCW 13.34.110. Court records other than the official file in a juvenile offender proceeding may not be released, except to those engaged in legitimate research for educational, scientific or public purposes where the anonymity of those mentioned in the records is preserved.
  3. Coroner Records. Coroner records that identify the deceased may be withheld for 48 hours or until the next of kin is notified, although the official may exercise discretion to release the records earlier to aid in identifying the deceased. RCW 68.50.300.
  4. Trade secrets. The Uniform Trade Secret Act (RCW ch. 19.08) operates as an “other statute” exemption. The Washington Supreme Court has held that the Public Records Act “is simply an improper means to acquire knowledge of a trade secret.” Progressive Animal Welfare Soc’y v. Univ. of Wash., 125 Wn.2d 243, 884 P.2d 592 (1994). Generally, a matter is protected as a trade secret if it derives economic value from not being generally known or readily ascertainable by others, and is the subject of reasonable efforts to maintain its secrecy.

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C. Court-derived exclusions, common law prohibitions, recognized privileges against disclosure

On the basis of the Public Records Act’s mandate that agencies disclose public records unless they fall within statutory exemptions, RCW 42.56.070(1), courts arguably should not be able to create additional exemptions. Prior to this amendment, some courts had created additional exemptions when it was thought to be in the “public interest” to protect certain documents from disclosure. In 1994, the Washington Supreme Court closed off a potential loophole in RCW 42.56.540, which states: “[E]xamination of any specific public record may be enjoined if . . . the superior court . . . finds that such examination would clearly not be in the public interest and would substantially and irreparably damage any person, or would substantially and irreparably damage vital governmental functions.”

The court held that Section 540 is simply a procedural provision allowing for an injunction suit and that parties seeking to avoid disclosure must rely on a specific statutory exemption, as well as establishing Section 540’s public interest and irreparable damage elements. Progressive Animal Welfare Soc’y v. University of Wash., 125 Wn.2d 243, 884 P.2d 592 (1994); Soter v. Cowles Publ’g Co., 162 Wn.2d 716, 174 P.3d 60 (2007).

Opponents of disclosure – typically, public employees or their unions – have periodically attempted to argue that disclosure under the PRA can violate their constitutional rights of privacy or association. Courts have rejected those arguments to date.  Doe v. Reed, 130 S. Ct. 3348 (2010); Wash. Pub. Emps. Ass’n v. Wash. State Ctr. for Childhood Deafness & Hearing Loss, 194 Wn.2d 484, 450 P.3d 601 (2019).COMPARE

D. Protective orders and government agreements to keep records confidential

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E. Interaction between federal and state law

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1. HIPAA

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2. DPPA

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3. FERPA

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4. Other

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F. Segregability requirements

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G. Agency obligation to identify basis of redaction or withholding

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III. Record categories – open or closed

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A. Autopsy and coroners reports

Autopsy reports are confidential under RCW 68.50.105.
Coroner records that identify the deceased may be withheld for 48 hours or until the next of kin is notified, although the official may exercise discretion to release the records earlier to aid in identifying the deceased. RCW 68.50.300.COMPARE

B. Administrative enforcement records (e.g., worker safety and health inspections, or accident investigations)

The Public Records Act does not specifically address administrative investigations as a separate category of records. Specific types of administrative investigative records may be subject to exemptions cited elsewhere in this outline.

Workplace safety investigations do not implicate the exemptions applicable to law enforcement investigations. Wade’s Eastside Gun Shop, Inc. v. Dep’t of Labor and Indus., 185 Wn.2d 270, 372 P.3d 97 (2016).COMPARE

C. Bank records

Examination reports and examination information obtained by the supervisor of banking are confidential under RCW 30.04A.075. However, investigation reports concerning applications for new banks are public. RCW 30.04A.075(7). Examination reports and information obtained by the department of financial institutions from banks, other financial institutions and securities brokers and investment advisers are confidential and exempt from public disclosure. RCW 42.56.400(6).COMPARE

D. Budgets

The only provision of the PRA addressing budgets is RCW 42.56.100, which includes within the definition of “public records” budgets held by the Clerk of the State House of Representatives and of the Secretary of the Senate.  For other agencies, budgets are treated no differently than any other public record.COMPARE

E. Business records, financial data, trade secrets

An agency can withhold valuable formulae, designs, drawings, computer source code or object code and research data obtained within five years of the disclosure request if disclosure would produce private gain and public loss. RCW 42.56.270(1). The Washington Supreme Court has held that “the public records act may not be used to acquire knowledge of a trade secret.” Confederated Tribes of Chehalis Reservation v. Johnson, 135 Wn.2d 734, 748, 958 P.2d 260 (1998). But see Lyft, Inc. v. City of Seattle, 190 Wn.2d 769, 418 P.3d 102 (2018) (explaining that a third party may not be entitled to block public disclosure of trade secrets contained in public records, absent heightened showing required by PRA injunction provision, RCW 42.56.540).

RCW 42.56.270 exempts a wide variety of financial and commercial information supplied to state agencies by requirement of law, including (among others) submissions in connection with ferry construction or road construction bids, RCW 42.56.270(2), export services, RCW 42.56.270(3), applications for loans in connection with state-sponsored programs, RCW 42.56.270(4), industrial development corporations, RCW 42.56.270(5), public sector retirement funds, RCW 42.56.270(6), workers’ compensation contractors, RCW 42.56.270(7), the Investment Opportunities Office, RCW 42.56.270(12), applications for a liquor, gambling or lottery retail license, RCW 42.56.270(10), submissions to the Department of Social and Health Services in connection with state purchased health care, RCW 42.56.270(11), and submissions to the Department of Ecology in connection with electronic product recycling, RCW 42.56.270(13). Other exemptions include account numbers supplied to an agency, RCW 42.56.230(4), financial and commercial information submitted to the state in connection with certain railroad contracts, RCW 42.56.480(1), private vocational schools, RCW 42.56.320(1), timeshare condominiums, RCW 42.56.340, drug manufacturers’ samples, RCW 42.56.360, organic food products, RCW 42.56.380(1), and commercial fertilizer, RCW 42.56.380(2).

In addition, lists of individuals sought merely for commercial purposes may be withheld. RCW 42.56.070(9).COMPARE

F. Contracts, proposals and bids

Information relating to ferry and highway construction, and railroad and export services bids may be withheld, although summaries of railroad contracts are open. RCW 42.56.270.COMPARE

G. Collective bargaining records

There is no specific exemption for collective bargaining materials.COMPARE

H. Economic development records

The Public Records Act exempts from disclosure financial and commercial information supplied in applications for economic development loans or program services provided by any local agency. RCW 42.56.270(4). Also exempt is certain financial and proprietary information submitted to the Department of Community, Trade, and Economic Development. RCW 42.56.270(12).COMPARE

I. Election Records

Voter poll books are to be made available under RCW 29A.08.720, but they cannot be used for commercial, nonpolitical purposes. Maps of precinct boundaries are to be made available under RCW 29A.16.050(7). The voter’s name, gender, voting records, date of registration and registration number are available for inspection and copying from voter registration cards, RCW 29A.08.710(2), though the identity of the office at which an individual registered to vote is not. RCW 29A.08.720. Information from absentee ballot applications is available under RCW 29A.40.130.

The Washington Secretary of State has found that referendum and initiative petitions are subject to disclosure under the Public Records Act, a practice that was generally upheld against a First Amendment challenge in Doe v. Reed, 130 S. Ct. 3348 (2010).

Campaign financing disclosure is required under RCW 42.17.030-.135. Lobbyists must register with the Public Disclosure Commission and make certain reports available under RCW 42.17.150-.230. Public officials must disclose their financial affairs under RCW 42.17.240-.241. Political advertising must be disclosed under RCW 42.17.510-.550. County auditor or county elections officer reports of primaries and elections are to be disclosed under RCW 29A.04.225 and 42.17.375.

County auditor or county elections officer reports of primaries and elections are to be disclosed under RCW 29A.04.225 and 42.17.375COMPARE

J. Emergency Medical Services records

No specific statute or case law speaks to this topic; such records likely are subject to the exemption for health care information, making them exempt except for certain directory information.  RCW 42.56.360(2).COMPARE

K. Gun permits

License applications for concealed pistols are exempt from public disclosure. RCW 42.56.240(4).COMPARE

L. Homeland security and anti-terrorism measures

Portions of records assembled, prepared or maintained to prevent or respond to criminal terrorist acts and specific and unique vulnerability assessments are exempt from disclosure. RCW 42.56.420(1). Also, records obtained as a result of national security briefings with state and local government are not subject to disclosure when they are not subject to disclosure under federal law. Id.see also Nw. Gas Ass’n v. Wash. Utils. & Transp. Comm’n, 141 Wn. App. 98, 168 P.3d 443 (2007). Other information regarding security within jails, schools, communications networks, and transportation systems may be exempt. RCW 42.56.420(2)-(6).COMPARE

M. Hospital reports

Records of the Public Hospital Commission are open to the public. RCW 70.44.050 (2000). A patient of a public hospital cannot be denied access to his or her own medical records. Oliver v. Harborview Med. Ctr., 94 Wn.2d 559, 618 P.2d 76 (1980).COMPARE

N. Personnel records

Information in files maintained for public officials and employees may be withheld “to the extent that disclosure would violate their right to privacy.” RCW 42.56.230(2). The “right to privacy” refers to matters that would be highly offensive to a reasonable person if disclosed and are not of public concern. RCW 42.56.050.COMPARE

1. Salary

Public employee salary information is generally subject to disclosure, although individual employee deductions may be protected by a right to privacy. 1973 Op. Atty. Gen. No. 4. Employee identification numbers are exempt, but names must be released. See Tacoma Pub. Library v. Woessner, 90 Wn. App. 357, 951 P.2d 357 (1998).COMPARE

2. Disciplinary records

Release of records related to teacher certification revocations, particularly as they pertain to teachers’ sexual misconduct with students, does not violate the teachers’ right to privacy. Brouillet v. Cowles Publ’g Co., 114 Wn.2d 788, 791 P.2d 526 (1990). However, disclosure of the identity of a teacher accused of sexual misconduct violates the teacher’s right to privacy under the statute if the allegation is not substantiated. Bellevue John Does 1-11 v. Bellevue Sch. Dist. #405, 164 Wn.2d 199, 189 P.3d 139 (2008). Disclosure of the mere fact that a public employer is investigating a public employee, or that the employee is on administrative leave, does not violate the employee’s right to privacy. Predisik v. Spokane Sch. Dist. No. 81, 182 Wash.2d 896, 346 P.3d 737 (2015).

Disclosure of employee performance evaluations, which do not discuss any specific instances of misconduct or the performance of public duties, is presumptively highly offensive to a reasonable person and not of legitimate public concern, and thus violative of the employee’s privacy rights and exempt. Dawson v. Daly, 120 Wn.2d 782, 797, 845 P.2d 995 (1993). Beltran v. DSHS, 98 Wn. App. 245, 989 P.2d 604 (1999). However, evaluations of high level employees, such as city manager, have more significant public interest and may not be exempt under DawsonSee Spokane Research v. City of Spokane, 99 Wn. App. 452, 994 P.2d 267 (2000).  A discharged school employee can obtain performance evaluations of other employees; however, the names of coworkers will be redacted unless there is a specific showing that the right to privacy should not apply. Ollie v. Highland Sch. Dist., 50 Wn. App. 639, 749 P.2d 757 (1988).COMPARE

3. Applications

Applications for public employment are exempt from disclosure. RCW 42.56.250(2).COMPARE

4. Personally identifying information

The residential addresses, telephone numbers, wireless numbers, personal email addresses, social security numbers, and emergency contact information of employees or volunteers of a public agency are exempt from disclosure. RCW 42.56.250(3).

The Washington Supreme Court has held that the state constitutional right of privacy does not apply to prevent disclosure of public records containing public employees’ dates of birth in connection with their full name. Wash. Pub. Emps. Ass’n v. Wash. State Ctr. for Childhood Deafness & Hearing Loss, 194 Wn.2d 484, 450 P.3d 601 (2019).COMPARE

5. Expense reports

There is no specific authority addressing disclosure of expense reports under the PRA.COMPARE

6. Evaluations/performance reviews

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7. Complaints filed against employees

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8. Other

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O. Police records

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1. Accident reports

Reports filled out by those involved in the accident are normally not available as public records.  RCW 46.52.080; Guillen v. Pierce Cnty., 144 Wn.2d 696, 31 P.3d 628 (2001). Accident reports filled out by police officers are public records and are generally subject to disclosure, at least once the investigation is complete.COMPARE

2. Police blotter

Police blotters, jail registers and incident reports are generally available prior to case closure. However, the Public Records Act permits withholding of law enforcement records if nondisclosure “is essential to effective law enforcement or for the protection of any person’s right to privacy.” RCW 42.56.240(1). The Washington Criminal Records Privacy Act (“CRPA”) prevents disclosure of certain criminal records, but does not apply to “[o]riginal records of entry maintained by criminal justice agencies” if the records are “compiled and maintained chronologically and are accessible only on a chronological basis.” RCW 10.97.030(1)(b). Thus, most information in chronological incident reports and blotters is public under both the CRPA and the Public Records Act, but the requester would have to know the date of the incident to locate the document.

The CRPA provides that records of convictions, other formal dispositions adverse to the subject and records of those currently in the criminal justice system (including those on parole) “may be disseminated without restriction.” RCW 10.97.050. Records on charges that have not resulted in conviction or other adverse disposition and for which formal proceedings are complete are closed to the public. Id.COMPARE

3. 911 tapes

911 tapes are available to the extent they are not covered by the investigative records exemption. See RCW 42.56. 240(1).COMPARE

4. Investigatory records

Specific investigative records are exempt if nondisclosure is essential to law enforcement or to protect a person’s right to privacy. RCW 42.56.240(1). The exemption covers only ongoing investigations, Ashley v. Pub. Disclosure Comm’n, 16 Wn. App. 830, 560 P.2d 1156, review denied, 89 Wn.2d 1010 (1977), and once the investigation is complete, the records are open. Hearst, 90 Wn.2d 123. Reports generated as part of routine administrative procedure, not as the result of a specific complaint or allegation of misconduct, are not “investigative reports.” Cowles Publ’g Co. v. City of Spokane, 69 Wn. App. 678, 683, 849 P.2d 1271 (noting that police reports regarding contact by K-9 dogs with citizen, generated as matter of course, are not investigative records), review denied, 122 Wn.2d 1013, 863 P.2d 73 (1993). Reports which could trigger an investigation and imposition of sanctions if warranted, but which are not themselves used for “law enforcement,” are not exempt. Id. at 684.

Investigative records related to pending criminal matters are presumptively subject to disclosure once a suspect has been arrested and referred to the prosecutor for a charging decision.  Seattle Times Co. v. Serko, 170 Wn.2d 581, 243 P.3d 919 (2010); Cowles Publ’g Co. v. Spokane Police Dep’t, 139 Wn.2d 472, 987 P.2d 620 (1999). The state supreme court at one point created a categorical exemption for “open and active” police investigation files in which disclosure would jeopardize the ability to solve the case. Newman v. King Cnty., 133 Wn.2d 565, 947 P.2d 712 (1997). The court later clarified that the categorical exemption only exists for “information contained in an open, active police investigation file.” Limstrom v. Ladenburg, 136 Wn.2d 595, 963 P.2d 869 (1998) (refusing to extend a categorical exemption to work product materials under RCW 42.56.290). In Cowles and again in Serko, the court further clarified that the concept of categorical exemption did not apply once the case was referred to the prosecutor’s office, even if the files remained technically open. See also Sargent v. Seattle Police Dep’t, 179 Wn.2d 376, 314 P.3d 1093 (2013).

The “right to privacy” refers to matters that would be highly offensive to a reasonable person if disclosed and are not of public concern. RCW 42.56.050; Hearst, 90 Wn.2d 123. In a torturous opinion, a Washington court held that whether statements in public records are “true” bears on whether the records are of legitimate concern to the public. City of Tacoma v. Tacoma News, Inc., 65 Wn. App. 140, 827 P.2d 1094, review denied, 119 Wn.2d 1020, 838 P.2d 692 (1992) (ruling that police records of investigation based on unsubstantiated allegation of child abuse against political candidate were not of legitimate public concern). But see Hudgens v. City of Renton, 49 Wn. App. 842, 746 P.2d 320 (1987) (holding arrest report, citation, and patrol report must be disclosed despite acquittal), review denied, 110 Wn.2d 1014 (1988). In Bellevue John Does 1-11 v. Bellevue School District #405, 164 Wn.2d 199, 189 P.3d 139 (2008), the Washington Supreme Court held that the identities of teachers accused of sexual misconduct are not subject to disclosure in cases where the allegations were not substantiated.

Police body worn camera recordings are subject to disclosure except to the extent necessary to protect a person’s “right to privacy,” under a modified version of the privacy test discussed above. Certain types of recordings are presumed to be “highly offensive,” including depictions showing the inside of medical facilities and residences, intimate images, minors and the body of a deceased person. RCW 42.56.240(14).  Public records requests for bodycam footage must also specify a particular individual involved in an incident, a specific officer, or the incident’s time and location. Id.

Criminal records on charges that have not resulted in conviction or other adverse disposition and for which formal proceedings are over are closed to the public. RCW 10.97.050; id. 10.97.030(8). Records of internal police investigations may be exempt from disclosure, to the extent nondisclosure is “essential to effective law enforcement or for the protection of any person’s right to privacy,” but these records are not categorically exempt (except, as with other investigative records, in the “narrow set of circumstances” in which “police have not yet referred the matter to a prosecutor for a charging decision and revelation to the defendant”).  Sargent v. Seattle Police Dep’t, 179 Wn.2d 376, 386–89, 392, 314 P.3d 1093, 1097–1100 (2013).  An agency seeking to withhold internal police investigation records must “prove that specific portions of the internal file are essential to effective law enforcement.” Id. at 394, 1101.  Further, not all law enforcement internal disciplinary investigations are considered investigative records.  For example, although a prison is recognized as a law enforcement agency, discipline records relating to prison medical staff are not investigative records.  Prison Legal News, Inc. v. Dep’t of Corr., 154 Wn.2d 628, 640, 115 P.3d 316 (2005).

Once the special investigation is complete, the records are open. Hearst Corp. v. Hoppe, 90 Wn.2d 123, 580 P.2d 246 (1978).COMPARE

5. Arrest records

The Criminal Records Privacy Act restricts access to pre-conviction and non-conviction records generally but not post-conviction records. Records of entry are accessible on a chronological basis, and records of those currently in the criminal justice system are not exempt. RCW 10.97.COMPARE

6. Compilations of criminal histories

The CRPA allows access to records of convictions and records of those currently in the criminal justice system; however, records on charges that have not resulted in conviction or other adverse disposition and for which formal proceedings are over are closed to the public. RCW 10.97.050.COMPARE

7. Victims

The identity of witnesses, victims and people who file criminal or quasi-criminal complaints with agencies other than the Public Disclosure Commission is exempt if disclosure would endanger a person’s life, property or physical safety, or if the complainant indicates at the time of filing the complaint that the complainant desires it to be confidential. RCW 42.56.240(2).

The CRPA restricts access to pre-conviction and nonconviction records generally but not post-conviction records. Records of entry are accessible on a chronological basis, and records of those currently in the criminal justice system are not exempt. RCW 10.97.

Coroner records that identify the deceased may be withheld for 48 hours or until the next of kin is notified, although the official may exercise discretion to release the records earlier to aid in identifying the deceased. RCW 68.50.300.COMPARE

8. Confessions

There are no specific restrictions on access to confessions unless they fall within the investigative records exemption under the Public Records Act, RCW 42.56.240(1), or the CRPA, RCW 10.97.050.COMPARE

9. Confidential informants

May be exempt pursuant to the Public Records Act’s investigative record exemption, RCW 42.56.240(1).COMPARE

10. Police techniques

Investigative records that disclose police techniques may be withheld if nondisclosure is necessary for effective law enforcement.  RCW 42.56.240(1).  The state Supreme Court has held that records of internal police investigations are public, but the names of complaining persons and law enforcement officers who are the subject of complaints may be withheld. Cowles Publ’g Co. v. Wash. State Patrol, 109 Wn.2d 712, 748 P.2d 597 (1988) (finding, on the facts of the case, that nondisclosure is necessary for effective law enforcement).COMPARE

11. Mugshots

Mugshots are exempt from disclosure. Cowles Publ’g Co. v. Spokane Police Dep’t, 139 Wn.2d 472, 987 P.2d 620 (1999).COMPARE

12. Sex offender records

Identifying information submitted to the statewide unified sex offender notification and registration program for the purpose of receiving notification regarding a registered sex offender is exempt from disclosure. RCW 42.56.240(8).COMPARE

13. Emergency medical services records

No specific statute or case law. Likely subject to the exemption for health care information, which is exempt except for certain directory information. RCW 42.56.360(2).COMPARE

14. Police video (e.g, body camera footage, dashcam videos)

Police body-worn camera recordings are subject to disclosure except to the extent necessary to protect a person’s “right to privacy,” under a modified version of the privacy test discussed above. Certain types of recordings are presumed to be “highly offensive,” including depictions showing the inside of medical facilities and residences, intimate images, minors and the body of a deceased person. RCW 42.56.240(14)(a).  Public records requests for bodycam footage must also specify a particular individual involved in an incident, a specific officer, or the incident’s time and location. RCW 42.56.240(14)(d).Furthermore, someone “directly involved in an incident recorded by the requested body worn camera recording” or their attorney, “has the right to obtain the … recording,” subject to exemptions.  RCW 42.56.240(14)(e).  Such individuals may not be charged for “any redaction” or other obscuring required before release of the recording.  Id. COMPARE

15. Biometric data (e.g., fingerprints)

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16. Arrest/search warrants and supporting affidavits

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17. Physical evidence

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P. Prison, parole and probation reports

Prison, parole and probation reports are generally open. The Criminal Records Privacy Act restricts access to pre-conviction and non-conviction records generally but not post-conviction records. Records of entry are accessible on a chronological basis, and records of those currently in the criminal justice system are not exempt. RCW 10.97.COMPARE

Q. Professional licensing records

Licensing test questions and other examination material are exempt from disclosure under RCW 42.56.250(1). Professional growth plans in educator license renewals are exempt under RCW 42.56.250(3). Statutes outside the Public Records Act may require confidentiality of other specific professional licensing records, and would operate as “other statute” exemptions under the PRA.COMPARE

R. Public utility records

Public utility records are generally available. See In Re Rosier, 105 Wn.2d 606, 717 P.2d 1353 (1986); 1983 Op. Atty. Gen. No. 9. However, residential addresses and telephone numbers of customers of a public utility may be withheld from public disclosure. RCW 42.56. 330(2). Also, the state Supreme Court has found a constitutional privacy interest in electric usage records, thus allowing disclosure by a public utility district only under authority of law. Matter of Maxfield, 133 Wn.2d 332, 344, 945 P.2d 196 (1997); see also RCW 42.17.314 (2000).COMPARE

S. Real estate appraisals, negotiations

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1. Appraisals

Real estate appraisals made in connection with the purchase or sale of property are exempt from disclosure until the earlier of (1) three years from the date of the appraisal or (2) consummation or abandonment of the transaction. RCW 42.56.260.COMPARE

2. Negotiations

No specific authority.  See section on Appraisals.COMPARE

3. Transactions

No specific authority.  See section on Appraisals.COMPARE

4. Deeds, liens, foreclosures, title history

No specific authority.  See section on Appraisals.COMPARE

5. Zoning records

No specific authority.COMPARE

T. School and university records

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1. Athletic records

There are no express restrictions and no case law concerning access to athletic records. Presumably, such records are available subject to privacy-based exemptions for student records. RCW 42.56.230(1).COMPARE

2. Trustee records

There are no special exemptions for trustee records. The only exemptions that would apply are those related to specific types of records that might be kept at schools and universities, referenced in the “Athletic records” section above. Also, “first class” public school districts — districts with a student enrollment in their public schools of 2,000 pupils or more — must make administrative records available for public inspection under RCW 28A.330.070.COMPARE

3. Student records

The Public Records Act contains an exemption for personal information “in any files maintained for students in public schools.” RCW 42.56.230(1). The exemption is narrow, and limited to information maintained in the collection of individual student files that the school necessarily maintains for the student. Lindeman v. Kelso Sch. Dist., 162 Wn.2d 196, 172 P.3d 329 (2007) (ruling that security video was not subject to the exemption). Federal law prohibits release of personally identifiable information, other than directory information, from the education records of a student absent written consent from a parent of a student or the eligible student. 20 U.S.C.A. § 1232g.COMPARE

4. School foundation/fundraising/donor records

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5. Research material or publications

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6. Other

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U. State guard records

The Washington State Guard is subject to the Public Records Act in the same manner as other state agencies.  See Ch. 323-10 WAC.COMPARE

V. Tax records

Tax returns, and information that would result in unfair competitive disadvantage to the taxpayer or violate the taxpayer’s right to privacy, are generally exempt. RCW 42.56.230(4). The “right to privacy” refers to matters that would be highly offensive to a reasonable person if disclosed and are not of public concern. RCW 42.56.050; Hearst Corp. v. Hoppe, 90 Wn.2d 123, 580 P.2d 246 (1978). Credit/debit card numbers and other financial account numbers are also exempt. RCW 42.56.230(4), (5). Personal information contained in documents used to apply for a driver’s license or identicard is exempt under RCW 42.56.230(6).COMPARE

W. Vital Statistics

Access to birth, death and marriage certificates changed significantly as of January 1, 2021. These documents are no longer generally accessible. Instead, only the subject of the record or those with certain qualifying relationships can obtain the certificates. The public will have access to “short form” death certificates that do not contain cause or manner of death information. Vital statistics may be made available for research purposes only upon entry of a data sharing agreement with the Department of Health. See generally RCW 42.56.365; RCW 70.58A.520.COMPARE

1. Birth certificates

See Vital statistics section above.COMPARE

2. Marriage and divorce

See Vital statistics section above.COMPARE

3. Death certificates

See Vital statistics section above.COMPARE

4. Infectious disease and health epidemics

While the Public Records Act contains numerous exemptions related to personal health care information, no specific provision governs access to statistics regarding epidemics.  The state Department of Health gathers and periodically reports on incidents of certain diseases.  See WAC 246-100; id. 246-101.COMPARE

IV. Procedure for obtaining records

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A. How to start

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1. Who receives a request?

The Public Records Act requires each agency to publish the procedures by which requests for public records are to be made. RCW 42.56.040. Many agencies provide information on their websites regarding how to make records requests or how to contact the applicable public records officers. A requesting party is not required to follow the agency procedure, but usually it is advisable to do so.COMPARE

2. Does the law cover oral requests?

Yes; on routine or simple matters, many agencies will make records available without a written request. Usually, however, a request should be made in writing to establish a clear record of the request.COMPARE

3. Required contents of a written request

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4. Can the requester choose a format for receiving records?

Washington law defines “public record” broadly to include electronic formats. RCW 42.56.010. There is no provision in the Act permitting agencies to limit the format in which public records may be examined or copied. Consequently, the requester can choose any available format for receiving the records. Although the PRA does not expressly require an agency to provide unredacted e-mails in an electronic format, an agency must do so where reasonable and feasible under the PRA’s “fullest assistance” provision (RCW 42.56.100). Mechling v. Monroe, 152 Wn. App. 830, 222 P.3d 808 (2009).COMPARE

5. Availability of expedited processing

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B. How long to wait

Promptness. The Public Records Act requires agencies to make a prompt response to requests for public records. RCW 42.56.520. “Promptness” means as soon as practicable, but, in any event, no longer than five days unless the agency can establish that it is impossible to meet the five-day deadline. Id. The agency can meet its five-day obligation simply by acknowledging the request and giving a reasonable estimate for how long it will take to respond.

Granting Disclosure. An agency’s response to a request for records cannot (with limited exceptions) be based on the requester’s identity or purpose. RCW 42.56.080. If the agency grants a request, it is to make the records available for inspection and copying during the customary office hours of the agency. RCW 42.56.090. The agency is also required to make agency facilities available for copying to the extent it would not disrupt agency operations. RCW 42.56.080. A public agency or official acting in good faith to comply with the Public Records Act may not be held liable for any loss or damage resulting from the release of a public record. RCW 42.56.060.

Explanation of Nondisclosure. The agency must explain the basis for its redaction or withholding of any record or portion of a record. RCW 42.56.070. The agency must identify the specific exemption authorizing withholding of the record, or part of the record, and briefly explain how the exemption applies to the record withheld. RCW 42.56.210(3). Furthermore, the agency must inform the requester of the fact that it has withheld records, and it must identify such records, or portions of records, with particularity. Progressive Animal Welfare Soc’y v. Univ. of Wash., 125 Wn.2d 243, 270-71, 884 P.2d 592 (1994), partial reconsideration denied (1995) (“PAWS”).

Delay. Courts have recognized that failure to respond in a timely manner is, in essence, a denial. Agencies that are slow in responding to requests should also be reminded that the court has the discretion to award penalties in an amount up to $100 per day for each day that the requester is denied the right to inspect or copy the records. RCW 42.56.550(4). Also, a requester may challenge in court an agency’s estimate of the time it will take to respond to a request. RCW 42.56.550(2).COMPARE

1. Statutory, regulatory or court-set time limits for agency response

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2. Informal telephone inquiry as to status

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3. Is delay recognized as a denial for appeal purposes?

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4. Any other recourse to encourage a response

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C. Administrative appeal

Requesters may ask the agency to review any denial of a records request. RCW 42.56.520(4). This administrative appeal is not required, but if the requester does take this step, the agency denial is deemed final (meaning the requester can file a lawsuit) within two days. Id. The PRA does not permit agencies to mandate that an administrative appeal process be exhausted before the requester may file a lawsuit; regulations purporting to impose such requirements are invalid. Kilduff v. San Juan Cnty., 194 Wn.2d 859, 453 P.3d 719 (2019).

The Public Records Act allows any requester whose public disclosure request has been denied to seek a written opinion from the Attorney General as to whether the record is exempt. RCW 42.56.530. The Attorney General’s determination of whether the records at issue are exempt, though persuasive, is not binding on the state agency or on the requester. Other informal avenues that have been successful are approaches to the attorney representing the agency. Often these attorneys are independent of the agency and, therefore, are willing to make an independent assessment of the legal situation.COMPARE

1. Time limit to file an appeal

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2. To whom is an appeal directed?

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3. Fee issues

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4. Contents of appeal

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5. Waiting for a response

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6. Subsequent remedies

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D. Additional dispute resolution procedures

The Public Records Act is generally enforced through private litigation. Any person who has been refused to allow inspection or copying of public records may demand judicial review through a civil lawsuit. RCW 42.56.550. Likewise, any person who believes that an agency has not provided a reasonable estimate of time that the agency requires to respond to a public records request may seek judicial review. Id. Alternatively, if a state agency denies a person an opportunity to inspect or copy a public record, the individual may request the attorney general’s office to review the matter and provide a written opinion. RCW 42.56.530. Such opinions are not binding on the agency, but may be persuasive.

An agency, or a third party named in or referred to in a record, is entitled to seek a court order enjoining the inspection of a public record. RCW 42.56.540; Dawson v. Daly, 120 Wn.2d 782, 845 P.2d 995 (1993). To obtain such an order, the agency or third party must establish not only that a specific exemption applies, but also that disclosure (1) clearly would not be in the public interest, and (2) would substantially and irreparably damage a person or a vital government interest. RCW 42.56.540; Lyft, Inc. v. City of Seattle, 190 Wn.2d 769, 773, 418 P.3d 102, 104 (2018).COMPARE

1. Attorney General

If a state agency denies a person an opportunity to inspect or copy a public record, the individual may request the attorney general’s office to review the matter and provide a written opinion. RCW 42.56.530. Such opinions are not binding on an agency or a court but may be persuasive.COMPARE

2. Ombudsperson

There is no ombudsperson provision in the Public Records Act. The Washington Attorney General’s Office has an “open government ombudsman,” who is available to consult on and assist with public records and open meetings issues. http://www.atg.wa.gov/OpenGovernment/Ombudsman.aspx.COMPARE

3. Other

There is no commission or agency that enforces the Public Records Act. The state Public Disclosure Commission only enforces the campaign finance disclosure aspects of the Public Disclosure Act. RCW 42.17.350, .360, .390.COMPARE

E. Court action

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1. Who may sue?

An action may be brought by a requester, by the agency, or by any person “named in the record or to whom the record specifically pertains.” RCW 42.56.540; id. 42.56.550.COMPARE

2. Priority

Such matters are not given any priority on the court calendar by statute.  As a practical matter, most courts will hear public records matters on short notice, provided no jury is requested.COMPARE

3. Pro se

Pro se actions are difficult. They require not only familiarity with rules concerning filing and serving a lawsuit but scheduling a hearing as well. More importantly, a pro se litigant will have difficulty with the substantive argument because the law has become complex and agency attorneys have become very sophisticated in litigating public disclosure cases.COMPARE

4. Issues the court will address

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a. Denial

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b. Fees for records

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c. Delays

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d. Patterns for future access (declaratory judgment)

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5. Pleading format

Not specified. The usual rules for civil litigation apply.COMPARE

6. Time limit for filing suit

Actions under the Public Records Act must be filed within one year of the agency’s claim of exemption, or the last production of a record on a partial or installment basis. RCW 42.56.550. The limitations period usually runs from the agency’s final, definitive response to a records request, but case law recognizes the possibility that the period can be extended (or “equitably tolled”) if the agency silently withholds responsive records. See Belenski v. Jefferson Cnty., 186 Wn.2d 452, 378 P.3d 176 (2016).COMPARE

7. What court?

The Public Records Act’s venue provision states that actions are to be brought in the superior court in the county in which the requested record is maintained.  RCW 42.56.550. If the agency being sued is a county, the suit may be brought in the superior court in a neighboring county. RCW 36.01.050.COMPARE

8. Burden of proof

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9. Judicial remedies available

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10. Litigation expenses

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a. Attorney fees

A requester who prevails against an agency that has denied a record must be awarded their costs, including reasonable attorneys’ fees. RCW 42.56.550(4).COMPARE

b. Court and litigation costs

A requester who prevails against an agency that has denied a record must be awarded their costs, including reasonable attorneys’ fees. RCW 42.56.505(4).COMPARE

11. Fines

A requester who prevails against an agency that has denied a record may also receive a civil penalty in an amount not to exceed $100 per day for each day that the requester was denied the right to inspect or copy the public record. RCW 42.56.550(4). The factors courts apply in determining the amount of such awards are set out in Yousoufian v. Office of Ron Sims, 168 Wn.2d 444, 229 P.3d 735 (2010).COMPARE

12. Other penalties

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13. Settlement, pros and cons

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F. Appealing initial court decisions

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1. Appeal routes

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2. Time limits for filing appeals

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3. Contact of interested amici

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G. Addressing government suits against disclosure

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Open Meetings

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I. Statute – basic application

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A. Who may attend?

“[A]ll persons” are generally permitted to attend any meeting of the governing body of a public agency. RCW 42.30.030. In the event that there is a disturbance and individuals are removed for disrupting the meeting, “[r]epresentatives of the press or other news media, except those participating in the disturbance,” will be allowed to remain in attendance. RCW 42.30.050. No one can be required, as a condition of attendance at a public meeting, to register his name or other information, to complete a questionnaire, or otherwise fulfill any condition precedent to attendance. RCW 42.30.040. Though a governing body may set reasonable rules of conduct so the meetings can be conducted in an orderly fashion, access cannot be limited and cameras and tape recorders cannot be prohibited unless they are actually disruptive. RCW 42.30.050; Op. Atty. Gen. 1998, No. 15.COMPARE

B. What governments are subject to the law?

OPMA applies to any public agency at the state, county, municipal or local level, and any subagency created by legislation, including planning commissions, library and park boards and commissions. RCW 42.30.020(1).COMPARE

1. State

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2. County

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3. Local or municipal

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C. What bodies are covered by the law?

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1. Executive branch agencies

OPMA only applies to meetings of the “governing body” of an agency or subagency. “Governing body” refers to multi-member boards, commissions, committees, councils, or any policy or rulemaking body. RCW 42.30.020(2). A committee of any governing body is also covered by OPMA whenever it acts on behalf of the government body, conducts hearings, or takes testimony or public comment. Id.COMPARE

a. What officials are covered?

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b. Are certain executive functions covered?

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c. Are only certain agencies subject to the act?

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2. Legislative bodies

The OPMA does not apply to the state legislature. RCW 42.30.020(1)(a). However, it is an open question as to whether the Act applies to caucuses and committees of the legislature. Thus far, the issue has been avoided because the legislative caucuses and committees have adopted open meeting rules that are as broad or more broad than OPMA.COMPARE

3. Courts

Courts are not covered by the Act. RCW 42.30.020(1)(a).COMPARE

4. Nongovernmental bodies receiving public funds or benefits

Private entities have been held to be “agencies” subject to the OPMA and Public Records Act if they are the “functional equivalent” of a public agency under a four-part test that looks to (1) whether the entity performs a governmental function; (2) the level of government funding; (3) the extent of government involvement or regulation; and (4) whether the entity was created by the government. See Fortgang v. Woodland Park Zoo, 187 Wn.2d 509, 387 P.3d 690 (2017); Clarke v. Tri-Cities Animal Care & Control Shelter, 144 Wn. App. 185, 181 P.3d 881 (2008); Telford v. Thurston Cnty. Bd. of Comm’rs, 95 Wn. App. 149, 974 P.2d 886 (1999).COMPARE

5. Nongovernmental groups whose members include governmental officials

The Act does not apply to nongovernmental groups except in specific instances, i.e., a policy group whose membership includes representatives of publicly owned utilities. RCW 42.30.020(1)(d). However, if a majority of the governing body of a particular agency meets with anyone else concerning agency business, then the meeting is considered a meeting of the governing body and is subject to the Act.COMPARE

6. Multi-state or regional bodies

Other than the policy group of publicly owned utilities mentioned above, there is no specific coverage for multistate or regional bodies. A federal court has held that meetings of interstate advisory committees are not subject to the Act where the governing body of any particular state agency did not attend nor did the multistate body have any final authority. United States v. State of Oregon, 699 F. Supp. 1456 (D. Or. 1988), aff’d, 913 F.2d 576 (9th Cir. 1990), cert. denied, 501 U.S. 1250 (1991).COMPARE

7. Advisory boards and commissions, quasi-governmental entities

If an advisory board or commission is created by or pursuant to statute, ordinance or other legislative act or if such group in fact sets policy for an agency, then these boards and commissions are covered by the Act. RCW 42.30.020(1). The Act does not apply to meetings of an interstate advisory body. Salmon for All v. State of Wash., 118 Wn.2d 270, 821 P.2d 1211 (1992).COMPARE

8. Other bodies to which governmental or public functions are delegated

A task force formed by a city’s planning advisory board to analyze a particular issue, take testimony and public comments, conduct hearings, and otherwise act on behalf of the board and city council is subject to the OPMA. Clark v. City of Lakewood, 259 F.3d 996 (9th Cir. 2001).

Meetings of a “critical areas ordinance team,” consisting of three of six members of a county council as well as county staff and consultants, were not subject to the OPMA because the body did not contain a majority of the council and did not act on the council’s behalf. Citizens Alliance for Property Rights Legal Fund v. San Juan Cnty., 184 Wn.2d 428, 359 P.3d 753 (2015).COMPARE

9. Appointed as well as elected bodies

There is no distinction between an elected and an appointed body.COMPARE

D. What constitutes a meeting subject to the law

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1. Number that must be present

The Act states that all meetings of the “governing body” must be open to the public. The governing body is defined as any multimember board, commission, committee, council, or other policy or rulemaking body. RCW 42.30.020(2). The meeting need not take place in a formal setting.

For example, in 1998, the Washington State Auditor found that Algona Economic Development Corporation Public Development Authority violated the OPMA when it held dinner meetings on the Spirit of Washington Dinner Train and on cruises in the Puget Sound. In 1999, the Auditor held that some members of the Monroe City Council violated the OPMA when they met after public meetings at a local restaurant. In both cases, the members of the governing body discussed business in addition to socializing. The business discussions made the gatherings meetings held in violation of the Act. Thus, any time members of a governing body discuss official business, the public must have access. Where a quorum of the city council takes “action” (as defined in the statute) at a standing committee meeting, a city council meeting has occurred. Op. Atty. Gen. 2010, No. 9, 2010 WL 4963127.COMPARE

a. Must a minimum number be present to constitute a “meeting”?

If a majority of the governing body or a quorum are engaged in deliberations or other action, the meeting is subject to the OPMA. Eugster v. City of Spokane, 128 Wn. App. 1, 114 P.3d 1200 (2005).COMPARE

b. What effect does absence of a quorum have?

Where a quorum of the city council takes “action” (as defined in the statute) at a standing committee meeting, a meeting has occurred. Op. Atty. Gen. 2010, No. 9, 2010 WL 4963127. Absent a quorum, the agency may take the position that no meeting can take place, but “serial meetings” in which the governing body seeks to avoid the OPMA by holding multiple meetings comprised of less than a quorum are likely impermissible.COMPARE

2. Nature of business subject to the law

“Meeting” means a meeting at which “action” is taken. RCW 42.30.020(4). “Action” includes discussion, public testimony, review, evaluation, and other deliberation, as well as “final” action. RCW 42.30.020(3). Final action is a collective positive or negative decision by formal motion or informal proposal or vote by the majority of members of the governing body. RCW 42.30.020(3); Miller v. City of Tacoma, 138 Wn.2d 318, 331, 979 P.2d 1129 (1999). In other words, there is a meeting whenever a governing body discusses agency business — even if no decisions are made.COMPARE

a. “Information gathering” and “fact-finding” sessions

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b. Deliberation toward decisions

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3. Electronic meetings

The Act says that “all” meetings of the governing body of a public agency shall be open and public. It does not require that such meetings be conducted in person. Presumably, meetings by conference call or e-mail are not prohibited so long as there is a speaker phone or video display terminal for the public who may wish to observe and/or listen to the proceedings. With the proper scheduling of meeting and agenda, such procedures likely would meet the requirements of the Act.

A 2017 attorney general opinion concluded that governing bodies of public agencies may conduct their meetings exclusively by telephone conference call, as long as the call is sufficiently open to the public. AGO 2017 No. 4 (Mar. 21, 2017). The attorney general suggested such meetings would be permissible if there were:

[O]ne or more specific locations [that] can be designated as the meeting place; notification of the meeting place(s) and time can be provided in the manner outlined in RCW 42.30.075; the agenda can be posted online if required by RCW 42.30.077; and a speaker phone can be provided at the designated meeting place(s) to enable those attending to hear the public discussions and to provide testimony.

Id. The attorney general concluded that a challenge to such a meeting under the OPMA would be “unlikely” to succeed.COMPARE

a. Conference calls and video/Internet conferencing

In 1996, the State Auditor held that two members of a three-member board violated the OPMA when one board member called another member to discuss agency business. The calls lasted from one minute to up to one hour. In 1996, the Auditor also found that a board that operates a public ambulance service in Skamania County violated the Act when two members of a three-member board used a third party to exchange information between the members which ultimately became part of an agreement signed by the board.COMPARE

b. E-mail

The exchange of e-mail messages may constitute a meeting within the meaning of the Open Public Meetings Act provided a majority of the governing body is involved and the use of e-mail is not merely informational or passive receipt of e-mail. Wood v. Battleground Sch. Dist., 107 Wn. App. 550, 27 P.3d 1208 (2001).COMPARE

c. Text messages

There is no authority addressing this issue.COMPARE

d. Instant messaging

There is no authority addressing this issue.COMPARE

e. Social media and online discussion boards

There is no authority addressing this issue.COMPARE

E. Categories of meetings subject to the law

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1. Regular meetings

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a. Definition

Regular meetings are “recurring meetings held in accordance with a periodic schedule declared by statute or rule.” RCW 42.30.075.COMPARE

b. Notice

OPMA does not specify any time limit for giving notice of a regular meeting. Agencies are only required to give notice in accordance with statutes or rules pertaining to that agency. By definition, “regular meeting” refers to a periodic schedule that has been established. See E.1.b(3) below.

OPMA does not specify to whom notice must be given for regular meetings. All that OPMA requires is that the governing body establish a time for holding regular meetings. RCW 42.30.070.

OPMA requires that the governing body of a public agency must adopt a regular meeting schedule “by ordinance, resolution, bylaws, or by whatever other rule is required for the conduct of business by that body.” RCW 42.30.070. State agencies must file a schedule of the time and place of regular meetings for publication with the Washington State Register on or before January of each year. Notice of any change from such meeting schedule must be published in the State Register for distribution at least 20 days prior to the rescheduled meeting date. RCW 42.30.075.

Public agencies with governing bodies must make the agenda of each regular board meeting available online no later than 24 hours before the published start time of the meeting. RCW 42.30.077. In the case of special meetings, advance notice is required. The notice must specify “the business to be transacted.” RCW 42.30.080.

There are no requirements for notice of a regular meeting beyond those described above.

If an agency fails to follow the minimal notice requirements of the OPMA, any person may commence an action for an injunction or mandamus. RCW 42.30.130. If the challenger prevails against the agency, he or she will recover his or her reasonable expenses and attorney fees in bringing the action, RCW 42.30.120(2). To prevail, the party need only establish that a violation occurred, not that the participants knowingly violated the law. See, e.g., Miller, 138 Wn.2d at 331-32 (awarding attorneys’ fees and costs despite findings that participants believed they were acting appropriately under the law. Also, any final actions taken may be declared null and void. RCW 42.30.060 (2000); Responsible Urban Growth Group v. Kent, 123 Wn.2d 376, 868 P.2d 861 (1994); Slaughter v. Snohomish Cnty. Fire Dist., 50 Wn. App. 733, 750 P.2d 656 (1988). Also, each member of the governing body who attends the meeting with knowledge that the meeting is in violation of the OPMA is personally liable for a civil penalty of $500 for the first violation, and $1,000 for subsequent violations. RCW 42.30.120(1), (2). A knowing violation can result in a recall from office. In re Recall of Pepper, 189 Wn.2d 546, 403 P.3d 839 (2017)], reconsideration denied (Dec. 4, 2017); In re Andersen, 131 Wn.2d 92, 929 P.2d 410 (1997); In re Recall of Roberts, 115 Wn.2d 551, 799 P.2d 736 (1990); Pedersen v. Moser, 99 Wn.2d 456, 662 P.2d 866 (1983); Cole v. Webster, 103 Wn.2d 280, 692 P.2d 799 (1984); Bocek v. Bailey, 81 Wn.2d 831, 505 P.2d 814 (1973). The Governor may also remove appointees confirmed by the Senate if the Governor believes such appointee has violated the OPMA. RCW 43.06.080; see also Price v. Seattle, 39 Wash. 376, 81 P. 847 (1905); State v. Johns, 139 Wash. 525, 248 P. 423 (1923) (confirming Governor’s plenary power to remove appointees believed to have committed misconduct or malfeasance).COMPARE

c. Minutes

OPMA does not have a provision regarding minutes. However, there is a separate state law which requires that minutes of regular and special meetings must be promptly recorded and open to public inspection. RCW 42.32.030. There is no definition of what is meant by “promptly.” Moreover, minutes of executive sessions are not required.
Written or taped minutes are public records and, therefore, are available under the Public Records Act. Minutes, or portions thereof, may be exempt from disclosure only if they fall within one of the exemptions to that Act.COMPARE

2. Special or emergency meetings

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a. Definition

None provided for special meetings. Emergency meetings, which may be held without notice, must involve an emergency threatening sudden, unexpected and severe physical damage to persons or property and requiring immediate action. RCW 42.30.080; Mead Sch. Dist. v. Mead Educ. Ass’n, 85 Wn.2d 140, 530 P.2d 302 (1975) (holding that an impending teacher’s strike was not such an emergency).COMPARE

b. Notice requirements

Special meetings may be called at any time by the presiding officer of the governing body so long as 24 hours advance written notice is given to each member of the governing body and to each media organization that has on file with the governing body a written request to be notified of special meetings. RCW 42.30.080; Kirk v. Pierce Cnty. Fire Protection Dist. No. 21, 95 Wn.2d 769, 630 P.2d 930 (1981). The notice must be posted on the agency’s website. RCW 42.30.080(2).

Agencies may call “emergency meetings” without notice.

An “agenda” is required in the announcement of a special emergency meeting. RCW 42.30.080, and an agency’s action must be limited to the listed agenda items. In 1999, the State Auditor held that the Bothell City Council violated the OPMA when it discussed a topic not on the published agenda for a special meeting. Washington State Auditor Schedule of Audit Findings for 1/1/99-12/31/99.

Penalties. If an agency fails to follow the minimal notice requirements of the OPMA, any person may commence an action for an injunction or mandamus. RCW 42.30.130. If the challenger prevails against the agency, he or she will recover his or her reasonable expenses and attorney fees in bringing the action, RCW 42.30.120(2). To prevail, the party need only establish that a violation occurred, not that the participants knowingly violated the law. See, e.g., Miller, 138 Wn.2d at 331-32 (awarding attorneys’ fees and costs despite findings that participants believed they were acting appropriately under the law). Also, any final actions taken may be declared null and void. RCW 42.30.060 (2000); Responsible Urban Growth Group v. Kent, 123 Wn.2d 376, 868 P.2d 861 (1994); Slaughter v. Snohomish Cnty. Fire Dist., 50 Wn. App. 733, 750 P.2d 656 (1988). Also, each member of the governing body who attends the meeting with knowledge that the meeting is in violation of the OPMA is personally liable for a civil penalty of $500 (or $1,000 after the first violation). RCW 42.30.120(1)–(2). A knowing violation can also result in a recall from office. In re Andersen, 131 Wn.2d 92, 929 P.2d 410 (1997); In re Recall of Roberts, 115 Wn.2d 551, 799 P.2d 736 (1990); Pedersen v. Moser, 99 Wn.2d 456, 662 P.2d 866 (1983); Cole v. Webster, 103 Wn.2d 280, 692 P.2d 799 (1984); Bocek v. Bailey, 81 Wn.2d 831, 505 P.2d 814 (1973). The Governor may also remove appointees confirmed by the Senate if the Governor believes such appointee has violated the OPMA. RCW 43.06.080; see also Price v. Seattle, 39 Wash. 376, 81 P. 847 (1905); State v. Johns, 139 Wash. 525, 248 P. 423 (1923) (confirming Governor’s plenary power to remove appointees believed to have committed misconduct or malfeasance).COMPARE

c. Minutes

OPMA does not have a provision regarding minutes. However, there is a separate state law that requires minutes of regular and special meetings to be promptly recorded and open to public inspection. RCW 42.32.030. There is no definition of what is meant by “promptly.” Moreover, minutes of executive sessions are not required.

Written or taped minutes are public records and, therefore, are available under the Public Records Act. Minutes, or portions thereof, may be exempt from disclosure only if they fall within one of the exemptions to that Act.COMPARE

3. Closed meetings or executive sessions

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a. Definition

The OPMA allows for closed meetings in only two circumstances: First, certain meetings may be closed because the OPMA is deemed not to apply to such meetings. RCW 42.30.140. Second, agencies are permitted, under certain circumstances, to have a closed executive session. RCW 42.30.110(1)(a)-(k). Any meeting to which OPMA does not apply or any specified circumstance in which executive sessions are permitted, may be closed to the public, including the press. RCW 42.30.110; id. 42.30.140 (2000).COMPARE

b. Notice requirements

An announcement of an executive session can take place any time; there is no specified time limit. OPMA does not require posting of notice of an executive or closed session; however, the presiding officer of the governing body must publicly announce the purpose for excluding the public from the meeting place. The governing body is only required to publicly announce to those in attendance that it is going into an executive session. RCW 42.30.110(2).

At the time a meeting is closed, the presiding officer must announce when the executive session will be concluded and, if it is not concluded at that time, the presiding officer must make a subsequent announcement as to the extension of the time. Id.

If an agency fails to follow the minimal notice requirements of the OPMA, any person may commence an action for an injunction or mandamus. RCW 42.30.130. If the challenger prevails against the agency, he or she will recover his or her reasonable expenses and attorney fees in bringing the action, RCW 42.30.120(2). To prevail, the party need only establish that a violation occurred, not that the participants knowingly violated the law. See, e.g., Miller, 138 Wn.2d at 331-32 (awarding attorneys’ fees and costs despite findings that participants believed they were acting appropriately under the law. Also, any final actions taken may be declared null and void. RCW 42.30.060 (2000); Responsible Urban Growth Group v. Kent, 123 Wn.2d 376, 868 P.2d 861 (1994); Slaughter v. Snohomish Cnty. Fire Dist., 50 Wn. App. 733, 750 P.2d 656 (1988). Also, each member of the governing body who attends the meeting with knowledge that the meeting is in violation of the OPMA is personally liable for a civil penalty of $500 (or $1,000 after the first violation). RCW 42.30.120(1)–(2). A knowing violation can also result in a recall from office. In re Andersen, 131 Wn.2d 92, 929 P.2d 410 (1997); In re Recall of Roberts, 115 Wn.2d 551, 799 P.2d 736 (1990); Pedersen v. Moser, 99 Wn.2d 456, 662 P.2d 866 (1983); Cole v. Webster, 103 Wn.2d 280, 692 P.2d 799 (1984); Bocek v. Bailey, 81 Wn.2d 831, 505 P.2d 814 (1973). The Governor may also remove appointees confirmed by the Senate if the Governor believes such appointee has violated the OPMA. RCW 43.06.080; see also Price v. Seattle, 39 Wash. 376, 81 P. 847 (1905); State v. Johns, 139 Wash. 525, 248 P. 423 (1923) (confirming Governor’s plenary power to remove appointees believed to have committed misconduct or malfeasance).COMPARE

c. Minutes

There is no requirement that minutes be taken during a closed meeting or an executive session. However, if minutes are taken, they become public records and may be exempt from disclosure only if Public Records Act exemptions apply.COMPARE

d. Requirement to meet in public before closing meeting

Although the OPMA does not expressly say so, it is clearly contemplated that a governing body will meet first in public before closing a meeting. OPMA states that before convening an executive session, the presiding officer must make a public announcement. RCW 42.30.110(2).COMPARE

e. Requirement to state statutory authority for closing meetings before closure

As stated above, the OPMA requires the presiding officer of a governing body to publicly announce the purpose for excluding the public from the meeting before going into executive session. RCW 42.30.110(2). It is generally accepted that the public announcement must specifically identify the exemption of the Act that is involved and the general subject matter of the closed session.COMPARE

f. Tape recording requirements

There is no requirement that meetings or minutes be tape recorded, although some agencies customarily do so. Such recordings are subject to the Public Records Act.COMPARE

F. Recording/broadcast of meetings

The use of cameras and other recording devices may not be prohibited unless they are actually disruptive. RCW 42.30.50; Op. Atty. Gen. 1998, No. 5. As a practical matter, broadcasting, recording and photographing are routinely allowed; however, care must be taken to avoid a secret recording that might run afoul of the state’s anti-eavesdropping statute. RCW 9.73.030.COMPARE

1. Sound recordings allowed

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2. Photographic recordings allowed

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G. Access to meeting materials, reports and agendas

As of 2014, public agencies are required to post the agendas of their governing bodies’ regular board meetings online no later than 24 hours before the published start time of the meeting. RCW 42.30.077.COMPARE

H. Are there sanctions for noncompliance?

Any action taken at meetings failing to comply with the Open Public Meetings Act is null and void. RCW 42.30.060. See Clark v. City of Lakewood, 259 F.3d 996 (9th Cir. 2001). Any person may commence an action either by mandamus or injunction to stop violations or prevent threatened violations of the Open Public Meetings Act. RCW 42.30.130. Individual members of the governing body who attend a meeting in violation of the Open Public Meetings Act with knowledge of the fact that the meeting is in violation of the OPMA are subject to personal liability in the amount of a $500 civil penalty (or $1,000 after the first violation). RCW 42.30.120(1), (2). Any person who prevails against a public agency for violation of the Open Public Meetings Act shall be awarded all costs, including reasonable attorneys’ fees, incurred in connection with such legal action. RCW 42.30.120(2).COMPARE

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A. Exemptions in the open meetings statute

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1. Character of exemptions

The OPMA provides for closed meetings in two circumstances. First, certain meetings may be closed because the OPMA is deemed not to apply to such meetings. Second, agencies are permitted, under certain circumstances, to have a closed executive session.

The areas not covered by the Act and the executive session exemptions are all discretionary. In other words, there is no requirement that such meetings be closed. The only other exemption to the OPMA is that in the event of a public disturbance, the governing body may order the room cleared of the public and the meeting may continue; however, members of the media who were not involved in the disturbance are allowed to remain. RCW 42.30.050.COMPARE

2. Description of each exemption

Meetings may be closed in the following situations because the OPMA is deemed inapplicable, RCW 42.30.140:

a. The formal granting or denying of a license permit or certificate to engage in a business, occupation or profession, or disciplinary proceedings involving a member of a business, occupation or profession;

b. Proceeding of a quasi-judicial nature relating to named parties. A county commission’s consideration of whether to grant a permit allowing a city to extend its sewer outfall, as a matter of significant public interest, was not a “quasi-judicial matter between named parties.” Protect the Peninsula’s Future v. Clallam County, 66 Wn. App. 671, 676, 833 P.2d 406 (1992). A four-part test is employed to determine whether an agency action is quasi-judicial:

(1) Whether a court could have been charged with making the agency’s decision; (2) whether the action is one which historically has been performed by courts; (3) whether the action involves the application of existing law to past or present facts for the purpose of declaring or enforcing liability; and (4) whether the action resembles the ordinary business of courts as opposed to that of legislators or administrators.

Id.;

c. Meetings involving matters covered by the state Administrative Procedure Act (“APA”) Ch. 34.05 RCW. (The APA has its own, more limited, provisions for “public observation.” See RCW 34.05.449.) The APA does not apply to local agencies. Victoria Tower P’ship v. City of Seattle, 49 Wn. App. 755, 745 P.2d 1328 (1987);

d. Collective bargaining sessions with employee organizations, including contract negotiations, grievance meetings, and discussions relating to the interpretation or application of a labor agreement; and

e. Meetings or portions of meetings concerning the strategy or position to be taken by the governing body during the course of collective bargaining, professional negotiations, grievance or mediation proceedings, or involving reviewing proposals made in such negotiations or proceedings.

Executive sessions may be called in the following situations, RCW 42.30.110(1)(a)-(m):

a. To consider matters affecting national security;

b. To consider, with legal counsel available, information regarding communications network security, risk assessments and related information that if made public may increase the risk to agency security or information technology infrastructure;

c. To consider the selection of a site or the acquisition of real estate by lease or purchase when public knowledge regarding such consideration would likely increase the price;

d. To consider the minimum price at which real estate will be offered for sale or lease when public knowledge regarding the consideration would likely lower the price;

e. To review negotiations on the performance of publicly bid contracts when public knowledge would likely increase costs;

f. To consider, in the case of a commercial export trading company, financial and commercial information supplied by private persons to the export trading company;

g. To receive and evaluate complaints or charges brought against a public officer or employee, unless the officer or employee requests that the meeting be open;

h. To evaluate qualifications of an applicant for public employment or to review the performance of a public employee. Final actions and discussions of generally applied salary levels must be open to the public;

i. To evaluate the qualifications of a candidate for employment to elective office. Interviews and final actions appointing candidates to elective office must be open;

j. To discuss certain matters with legal counsel when public knowledge of the discussion is likely to result in adverse legal or financial consequences to the agency;

k. To discuss western library network prices, products, equipment and services, when public discussion would reduce the network’s competitiveness, though final actions must be taken in public;

l. To consider, in the case of the State Investment Board, financial and commercial information when the information relates to the investment of public trust or retirement funds and when public knowledge regarding the discussion would result in loss to such funds or in private loss to the providers of this information;

m. To consider proprietary or confidential non-published information related to the development, acquisition, or implementation of state purchased healthcare services;

n. To consider, in the case of the life sciences discovery fund authority, the substance of grant applications and grant awards when public knowledge regarding the discussion would reasonably be expected to result in private loss to the providers of this information;

o. To consider in the case of a health sciences and services authority, the substance of grant applications and awards when public knowledge regarding the discussion would reasonably be expected to result in private loss to the providers of this information; and

p. In the case of public hospitals, to consider information regarding staff privileges or quality improvement committees.COMPARE

B. Any other statutory requirements for closed or open meetings

Before convening an executive session, the presiding officer must publicly announce both the purpose for excluding the public and the time at which the executive session is to conclude. RCW 42.30.110(2). There is no similar requirement with respect to meetings to which the Act does not apply. Minutes are not required during closed or executive sessions; however, if such minutes are made they must be made promptly.COMPARE

C. Court mandated opening, closing

No decisions have mandated that specific future meetings be open or closed. Instead, courts have ruled that based on the facts before them closed meetings did or did not violate the Act. See, e.g., Columbia Riverkeeper v. Port of Vancouver USA, 188 Wn.2d 421, 395 P.3d 1031 (2017); Miller v. City of Tacoma, 138 Wn.2d 318, 979 P.2d 429 (1999) (City Council members’ informal balloting to fill commission position should have occurred in an open meeting instead of the closed executive session); Protect the Peninsula’s Future v. Clallam Cnty., 66 Wn. App. 671, 833 P.2d 406 (1992) (executive session was improper where review of shoreline permit application involved matter of substantial importance to the public); Walla Walla Union-Bulletin v. Walla Walla Cnty. Comm’n, 15 Media L. Rep. 1208 (1988) (closed commission meeting violated OPMA); Port Townsend Publ’g Co. v. Brown, 18 Wn. App. 80, 567 P.2d 664 (1977) (no violation where closed session of county commission involved Comprehensive Employment and Training Act).COMPARE

III. Meeting categories – open or closed

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A. Adjudications by administrative bodies

Adjudications by state administrative bodies are generally covered by the APA and, therefore, are not covered by the OPMA. RCW 42.30.140(3). As a general rule, the fact-finding of such bodies is open, but the deliberations are closed.COMPARE

1. Deliberations closed, but not fact-finding

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2. Only certain adjudications closed, i.e. under certain statutes

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B. Budget sessions

Budget sessions are open to the public except those portions that might be closed because they fall within one of the categories for permissible executive sessions.COMPARE

C. Business and industry relations

The only limitation is where the governing body is considering financial and commercial information pertaining to export trading companies.COMPARE

D. Federal programs

There is no limit in OPMA on public attendance at meetings to discuss federal programs.COMPARE

E. Financial data of public bodies

No limitation.COMPARE

F. Financial data, trade secrets, or proprietary data of private corporations and individuals

There is no express limitation other than on financial and commercial information pertaining to export trading companies. RCW 42.30.110(1)(e).COMPARE

G. Gifts, trusts and honorary degrees

No limitation; such discussions should be open.COMPARE

H. Grand jury testimony by public employees

Grand jury testimony is not covered by OPMA. However, such testimony is not generally open to the public. RCW 10.27.080, .090, .150.COMPARE

I. Licensing examinations

Meetings concerned with granting or denying a license are excluded from OPMA and, therefore, may be closed. See RCW 42.30.140. However, the fact-finding portion of such meetings often is open to the public.COMPARE

J. Litigation, pending litigation or other attorney-client privileges

An executive session may be held to discuss certain matters with legal counsel representing the agency when public knowledge of the discussion is likely to result in “adverse legal or financial consequence” to the agency. RCW 42.30.110(1)(i). Matters that may, for this reason, be discussed in closed session are those relating to agency enforcement actions and to present or potential litigation to which the agency, the governing body or a member acting in an official capacity is, or is likely to become, a party.COMPARE

K. Negotiations and collective bargaining of public employees

Negotiations and collective bargaining sessions, as well as grievance and contract interpretation meetings are excluded from OPMA. Also, meetings of the governing body itself to consider the strategy or position to be taken by such body during the course of collective bargaining or negotiations are not subject to any provision of the Act. See RCW 42.30.140.COMPARE

1. Any sessions regarding collective bargaining

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2. Only those between the public employees and the public body

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L. Parole board meetings, or meetings involving parole board decisions

The state Board of Prison Terms and Paroles has adopted rules stating that all Board proceedings are open to the public, unless the Board states on the record “a good cause” for denying access to observers, including members of the press.COMPARE

M. Patients, discussions on individual patients

There is no specific exemption for such meetings if they involve the governing body.COMPARE

N. Personnel matters

Personnel matters, as a rule, must be discussed in open session. However, an agency may close a meeting to receive and evaluate complaints or charges brought against a public officer or employee, to evaluate qualifications of an applicant for public employment, or to review the performance of a public employee, unless the employee requests that the meeting be open. However, final action on hiring, setting salaries, or discharging or disciplining any employee must occur in a public meeting. See RCW 42.30.110(1)(f) and (g).COMPARE

1. Interviews for public employment

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2. Disciplinary matters, performance or ethics of public employees

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3. Dismissal, considering dismissal of public employees

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O. Real estate negotiations

An agency may close a meeting of the governing body to consider the selection of a site or the acquisition of real estate by lease or purchase when public knowledge regarding consideration likely would increase the price. Similarly, a public agency may close a meeting of the governing body to consider the minimum price at which real estate will be offered for sale or lease when public knowledge regarding the considerations likely would lower the price. See RCW 42.30.110(1)(b) and (c).COMPARE

P. Security, national and/or state, of buildings, personnel or other

An agency may close a meeting to consider matters “affecting national security.” RCW 42.30.110(1)(a).COMPARE

Q. Students, discussions on individual students

The OPMA has no provision for closing a meeting to discuss an individual student. Moreover, meetings of a student board which is the governing body of the recognized student association of a campus of a public institution of higher education must conform to the requirements of the Act. RCW 42.30.200.COMPARE

IV. Procedure for asserting right of access

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A. When to challenge

There is no specific statutory requirement as to when a closed meeting must be challenged. Therefore, the normal statute of limitations of two years and the doctrine of laches probably apply.COMPARE

1. Does the law provide expedited procedure for reviewing request to attend upcoming meetings?

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2. When barred from attending

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3. To set aside decision

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4. For ruling on future meetings

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5. Other

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B. How to start

Although it is not required by the Act, a reporter should probably make an oral protest and urge the agency to keep a meeting open. The reporter might ask the governing body to take a vote as to whether or not to close the meeting, or to allow sufficient time for the reporter to contact an editor or lawyer to further present arguments to the governing body.
The OPMA is enforced through private civil litigation.COMPARE

1. Where to ask for ruling

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a. Administrative forum

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b. State attorney general

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c. Court

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2. Applicable time limits

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3. Contents of request for ruling

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4. How long should you wait for a response

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5. Are subsequent or concurrent measures (formal or informal) available?

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C. Court review of administrative decision

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1. Who may sue?

Any person may bring a suit in the local county court. RCW 42.30.120, .130.COMPARE

2. Will the court give priority to the pleading?

Such matters are not given any priority on the court calendar by statute. The usual civil rules apply.COMPARE

3. Pro se possibility, advisability

Pro se actions are difficult. They require not only familiarity with rules concerning filing and serving a lawsuit but scheduling a hearing as well. Pro se litigants must be aware that they may be liable for attorneys’ fees if they lose and the court finds that their action was frivolous. RCW 42.30.120(2).COMPARE

4. What issues will the court address?

Not specified.COMPARE

a. Open the meeting

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b. Invalidate the decision

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c. Order future meetings open

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5. Pleading format

Not specified. The usual rules of civil procedure apply.COMPARE

6. Time limit for filing suit

There is no specific statutory requirement as to when a closed meeting must be challenged. Therefore, the normal statute of limitations of two years and the doctrine of laches probably apply.COMPARE

7. What court?

Suit may be brought in the local county court. RCW 42.30.120, .130.COMPARE

8. Judicial remedies available

The court may void any final actions taken at the meeting, if the governing body failed to comply with the OPMA. The court also may enjoin prospective or future violations. However, where there is no evidence that the agency will hold another meeting in violation of the OPMA, injunctive relief is not appropriate. Protect the Peninsula’s Future v. Clallam County, 66 Wn. App. 671, 677, 833 P.2d 406 (1992).COMPARE

9. Availability of court costs and attorney’s fees

A successful litigant challenging the agency’s closure may obtain attorneys’ fees and costs. RCW 42.30.120(2).COMPARE

10. Fines

The court may assess a civil penalty of $500 against each member of the governing body of the agency who attended the meeting knowing it was in violation of the OPMA, or $1,000 for subsequent violations. RCW 42.30.120(1)(2).COMPARE

11. Other penalties

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D. Appealing initial court decisions

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1. Appeal routes

Appeal may be taken to the state Court of Appeals and, from there, to the state Supreme Court, under the usual rules of appellate procedure.COMPARE

2. Time limits for filing appeals

Thirty days.COMPARE

3. Contact of interested amici

Interested amici can learn of open meeting issues that may be pending before the state Supreme Court by consulting published lists at the beginning of each court term. The lists, available on the court’s website, will contain the names of cases to be heard and the basic issues in those cases.

The Reporters Committee for Freedom of the Press often files amicus briefs in cases involving significant media law issues before a state’s highest court.COMPARE

V. Asserting a right to comment

The OPMA addresses the public’s right to observe, not to participate, in a public meeting. However, a member of the public shall not be required, as a condition to attend a meeting, to register his or her name and other information, to complete a questionnaire, or otherwise to fulfill any condition precedent to attendance. RCW 42.30.040.

There is no right to participate, unless the agency has adopted rules requiring or permitting such participation.

If a meeting is interrupted by a person or a group so as to render the orderly conduct of the meeting unfeasible and order cannot be restored by the removal of individuals who are interrupting the meeting, the members of the governing body conducting the meeting may order the meeting room cleared and continue in session or may adjourn the meeting and reconvene at another location selected by a majority vote of the members. RCW 42.30.050. However, representatives of the press or other news media, except those participating in the disturbance, shall not be removed and may attend any session held after members of the public have been excluded due to disruption. Id.COMPARE

A. Is there a right to participate in public meetings?

COMPARE

B. Must a commenter give notice of intentions to comment?

COMPARE

C. Can a public body limit comment?

COMPARE

D. How can a participant assert rights to comment?

COMPARE

E. Are there sanctions for unapproved comment?

COMPARE

Appendix

COMPARE

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The Mahatma’s 7 Social Sins

Seven Social Sins is a list by Frederic Donaldson that Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi published in his weekly newspaper Young India on 22 October 1925.[1] Later he gave this same list written on a piece of paper to his grandson, Arun Gandhi, on their final day together shortly before his assassination.[2]

Mohandas Gandhi published the list of “Seven Social Sins” in 1925. 

Gandhi listed the sins as:

  1. Wealth without work.
  2. Pleasure without conscience.
  3. Knowledge without character.
  4. Commerce without morality.
  5. Science without humanity.
  6. Religion without sacrifice.
  7. Politics without principle.

History

The list was published by Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi in his weekly newspaper Young India on 22 October 1925.[1] An almost identical list had been published six months earlier in England in a sermon at Westminster Abbey by Fredrick Lewis Donaldson.[3] Gandhi wrote that a correspondent whom he called a “fair friend” had sent the list: “The… fair friend wants readers of Young India to know, if they do not already, the following seven social sins,”[1] (the list was then provided). After the list, Gandhi wrote that “Naturally, the friend does not want the readers to know these things merely through the intellect but to know them through the heart so as to avoid them.”[1] This was the entirety of Gandhi’s commentary on the list when he first published it.

Influence

In the decades since its first publication, the list has been widely cited and discussed. Some books have also focused on the seven sins or been structured around them:

  • Eknath Easwaran (1989). The Compassionate Universe: The Power of the Individual to Heal the Environment (listed, discussed, and served as chapter structure for book)[4]
  • Stephen Covey (1989). Principle-Centered Leadership ( Chapter 7: Seven Deadly Sins (p. 87 to 93).[5][6]
  • Frank Woolever (2011) Gandhi List of Social Sins: Lessons in Truth[7]

Many books have discussed the sins more briefly:

  • Peter J. Gomes (2007). The scandalous gospel of Jesus: What’s so good about the good news?[8] Page 122 states “Years ago, I was much encouraged when I discovered that Gandhi had a list of seven social sins that, if not resisted, could destroy both persons and countries. …. We live in a world in which these social sins flourish as much today as they did in Gandhi’s time; surely the battle against them is still worth waging.”
  • Adam Taylor (2010). Mobilizing hope: Faith-inspired activism for a post-civil rights generation[9] Page  155 mentions two of the social sins, stating “The recent economic collapse (now referred to as the Great Recession) reminds me of two social sins from Gandhi’s famous list of seven deadly social sins. Gandhi warned about the dangers of wealth without work and commerce without morality….”
  • Thomas Weber (2011). “Gandhi’s Moral Economics: the Sins of Wealth Without Work and Commerce Without Morality.”[10] Page 141 lists the sins and their date of publication, stating that “These and many of Gandhi’s own writings make it quite clear that the Mahatma did not compartmentalize his life. For him, economics together with politics, morality and religion formed an indivisible whole.”
  • Rana P. B. Singh (2006). “Mohandas (Mahatma) Gandhi.”[11] Page  107 lists the sins and gives a 2 or 3 sentence explanation of each, stating “these are ideals, but they are more relevant in the present era of desperation and could easily be accepted.”

They have also been anthologized:

  • Anil Dutt Misra (2008). Inspiring Thoughts Of Mahatma Gandhi [12]

In 2025, Ahir Shah made a BBC Radio 4 series, 7 Blunders of the World, based on the list.[13]

Politics without principle

Regarding “politics without principle”, Gandhi said[citation needed] having politics without truth(s) to justly dictate the action creates chaos, which ultimately leads to violence. Gandhi called these missteps “passive violence”, ‘which fuels the active violence of crime, rebellion, and war.’ He said, “We could work ’til doomsday to achieve peace and would get nowhere as long as we ignore passive violence in our world.”[14]

Politics is literally defined as, “The struggle in any group for power that will give one or more persons the ability to make decisions for the larger group.”[15]

Mohandas Gandhi defined principle as, “the expression of perfection, and as imperfect beings like us cannot practice perfection, we devise every moment limits of its compromise in practice.”[16]

There are many different types of regimes in the world whose politics differ. Based on Gandhi’s Blunder Politics without Principle, a regime type might be more of a root of violence than another because one regime has more principle than the other. Regimes have different types of fighting and aggression tactics, each desiring different outcomes.

This difference affects the actions taken by political heads in countries across the globe. Gandhi wrote, “An unjust law is itself a species of violence.”[17] The aggression of one country on another may be rooted in the government’s creation of an unjust law. For example, a war of irredentism fought for one state to reclaim territory that was lost due to a law promoting ethnic cleansing.[citation needed]

Principle in one country could easily be a crime in another. This difference leads one to believe that the root of violence is inevitably present somewhere in the world. “Politics without Principle” will inevitably take place throughout time.[citation needed]“I object to violence because when it appears to do good, the good is only temporary; the evil it does is permanent.”[18]

This list grew from Gandhi’s search for the roots of violence. He called these “acts of passive violence”. Preventing these is the best way to prevent oneself or one’s society from reaching a point of violence, according to Gandhi.[citation needed]

To this list, Arun Gandhi added an eighth blunder, “rights without responsibilities”.[19] According to Arun Gandhi, the idea behind the first blunder originates from the feudal practice of Zamindari. He also suggests that the first and the second blunders are interrelated.[citation needed]

Arun Gandhi description as “Seven Blunders”

Arun Gandhi, who was personally given the list by his grandfather, Mohandas Gandhi, has described it as a list of “Seven Blunders of the World” that lead to violence.

More recently Mohandas Gandhi’s list of negative qualities has also been described by his grandson as “Seven Blunders of the World”. Examples of description under this heading include:

  • Knickerbocker, Brad (1 February 1995). “Gandhi grandson pursues peace”Christian Science Monitor. p. 14. ISSN 0882-7729(sidebar) (profile of Arun Gandhi that gives a list entitled “Mohandas Gandhi’s ‘Seven Blunders of the World,'” and states that “The last time Arun saw his grandfather, the old man slipped the boy a piece of paper with a list of what have come to be known as Gandhi’s ‘Seven Blunders of the World’ that lead to violence.” It also states that Arun Gandhi “would make ‘Rights without responsibilities’ No. 8 on his grandfather’s list of ‘blunders.'”)

See also

References

  1. Jump up to:a b c d The Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi (electronic edition), Vol. 33, pp. 133-134. ISBN 8123007353ISBN 9788123007359 OCLC 655798065
  2. ^ Gandhi’s “Seven Blunders of the World” That Lead to Violence . . . Plus 5 Archived 15 September 2006 at the Wayback Machine
  3. ^ “Evils of World are Outlined”. Archived from the original on 2 April 2017.
  4. ^ Easwaran, Eknath (1989). The Compassionate Universe: The Power of the Individual to Heal the Environment. Tomales, CA: Nilgiri Press. 
    ISBN 9780915132591OCLC 20393226ISBN 0915132591ISBN 9780915132584,
     ISBN 0915132583
  5. ^ “Seven Deadly Sins as per Mahatma Gandhi”. mkgandhi.org. Retrieved 19 April 2014.
  6. ^ Covey, Stephen R. (2009). Principle-Centered Leadership. RosettaBooks. pp. 87–93. ISBN 978-0-7953-0959-5.
  7. ^ Woolever, Frank (2011). Gandhi’s List of Social Sins: Lessons in Truth. Pittsburgh, PA: Dorrance Publishing. ISBN 9781434907943OCLC 801817588ISBN 1434907945 (focuses on the list)
  8. ^ Gomes, Peter J. (2007). The scandalous gospel of Jesus: What’s so good about the good news?. New York: HarperOne. ISBN 9780060000738OCLC 125402376.
  9. ^ Taylor, Adam (2010). Mobilizing hope: Faith-inspired activism for a post-civil rights generation. Downers Grove, IL: IVP Books. ISBN 9780830838370.
  10. ^ In: Brown, Judith M.Anthony Parel (2011). The Cambridge Companion to Gandhi. Cambridge, UK: Cambridge University Press. pp. 135–153. ISBN 9780521116701OCLC 646309046.
  11. ^ In: Simon, David (Ed.) (2006). Fifty key thinkers on development. London: Routledge. pp. 106–110. ISBN 9780203098820OCLC 68710779.
  12. ^ Inspiring Thoughts Of Mahatma Gandhi Concept Publishing Co. ISBN 9788180694417 (listed, p. 239)
  13. ^ Shah, Ahir (7 January 2025). “Ahir Shah’s Seven Blunders of the World”BBC. Retrieved 21 April 2025.
  14. ^ Meadows, Donella. “Gandhi’s Seven Blunders — and then Some”The Donella Meadows Archive. Archived from the original on 4 July 2011. Retrieved 27 June 2011.
  15. ^ O’Neil, Patrick H. (2009). Essentials of Comparative Politics. New York: W. W. Norton & Company. p. 323ISBN 9780393933772.
  16. ^ Gandhi, Mohandas (14 September 2018). “Inspired Words by Mohandas Gandhi”Wisdom Quotes.
  17. ^ Gandhi, Mohandas. “Quote – An unjust law is itself a species of violence. Arrest for its breach is more so…” Wisdom Quotes. Retrieved 27 June 2011.
  18. ^ Gandhi, Mohandas. “Mahatma Gandhi quotes”. Retrieved 30 June 2011.
  19. ^ Arun Gandhi’s article
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The Elixir of Life (Podcast & Transcript 6-6-25)

Elixir of Life Podcast AUDIO (Listen/Play)

The Elixir of Life transcript

(June 6, 2025 Podcast)

Doctor and special correspondent Avir Mitra takes Lulu on an epic journey live on stage at a little basement club called Caveat, here in New York. Starting with an ingredient in breastmilk that babies can’t digest, a global hunt that takes us from Bangladesh to the Mennonite communities here in the US, we discover an ancient symbiotic relationship that might be on the verge of disappearing. So sip a vicarious cocktail, settle in, and explore the surprising ways our bodies forge deep, invisible connections that shape our lives.

This live show is part of a series we are doing with Avir that we are calling “Viscera.” Each event is a conversation that takes the audience on a journey into a quirk or question or mystery inside of us, and gives them a visceral experience with the viscera of us. The previous installment of the series, was called “How to Save a Life.”

Special thanks to Tim Brown, David Mills, Carlito Lebrilla, Bethany Henrik, Danielle Lemay, Katie Hinde, Jennifer Smilowitz, Angela Zivkovic, Daniela Barile, Mark Underwood.

EPISODE CREDITS:
Reported by Avir Mitra
with help from Anisa Vietze
Original music from Dylan Keefe
Sound design contributed by Dylan Keefe, Iván Barenboim
Fact-checking by Natalie Middleton.

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Follow our show on InstagramTwitter and Facebook @radiolab, and share your thoughts with us by emailing radiolab@wnyc.org.
Leadership support for Radiolab’s science programming is provided by the Simons Foundation and the John Templeton Foundation. Foundational support for Radiolab was provided by the Alfred P. Sloan Foundation.

[RADIOLAB INTRO]

LULU MILLER: Latif?

LATIF NASSER: Yeah? Lulu?

LULU: [laughs] So I have a special treat for you today.

LATIF: Okay.

LULU: Recently I got to do a live show. It was in a little club in New York City called Caveat.

LATIF: Oh, I’ve always wanted to go there! Yeah.

LULU: It’s really cute. It’s got, like, a cabaret underground vibe.

LATIF: Are you finally singing? I feel like you’ve been just waiting to get out there and sing.

LULU: You know, I did not sing in this show at all. But there were live musicians, including Dylan Keefe on upright bass, our director of sound design.

LULU: Okay, thank you all for coming out. Thank you kindly.

LULU: And a rock star of sorts.

LULU: Without further ado, Avir Mitra. Can we get some bring-on music?

LATIF: Ooh, Avir!

LULU: Yeah. So as you know, Avir Mitra is our ER doctor, special correspondent.

LATIF: Mm-hmm.

LULU: Who has done some of the most beloved medical mystery tales on the show.

LATIF: So many vultures, plane crashes.

LULU: Mm-hmm. Easter Island dirt.

LATIF: That’s right. Yeah.

LULU: And he had another one in store that he told on stage that night. Truly an odyssey. Takes us all over the globe. We blow by the Mennonite community, we go to Gambia, we go back into deep evolutionary time to stage a reunion, a physical reunion with what Avir calls humanity’s oldest friend.

LATIF: Hmm!

LULU: And he kicked off the whole thing with a bottle full of white liquid.

AVIR MITRA: We’re talking about the magical substance that is breast milk.

[cheers]

LULU: And because, as you know, I recently had a baby, the breast milk was provided by me.

LULU: I have an eight month old. I am breastfeeding. I also use formula. This is not—this is not—we’re not here to say one or the other is better. But instead …

LULU: And so we just kind of held it up to the spotlight, everyone was looking at it. And Avir kicked the whole thing off with just a simple question.

AVIR: Here, I guess I’m gonna throw it to the crowd. Like, if we just had to name the components of breast milk—and I’m gonna take one off the table. We know that it’s 87 percent water. Okay, fine. That’s easy. But the solid part. Like, name some things. What’s in breast milk?

AUDIENCE MEMBER: Vodka.

AVIR: Vodka?

LULU: [laughs] Depending on the mother’s night.

AVIR: Yeah. Yeah, right.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: Fat.

AVIR: Fat.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: Sugar.

AVIR: Sugar. Proteins, hormones. Calcium.

LULU: Calcium.

AVIR: You guys are right. I mean, everything you’re saying is right. But there is something that we’ve missed. It’s called human milk oligosaccharides. And what’s crazy is it’s actually the third-largest compound in breast milk, way above protein. So, you know, you have lactose.

LULU: Oh!

AVIR: That’s the sugar that someone mentioned. You have lipids. That’s fat. And then you have these HMOs, and they are strange.

LATIF: Wait. HMOs?

LULU: [laughs] Yeah, it’s not your healthcare—health insurance organization.

LATIF: Oh.

LULU: They are—they’re actually sugars, but as Avir told us, they are totally different than normal sugars. And they form into these kind of gorgeous but strange elaborate shapes.

AVIR: Branches and chains and ferns and weird shapes.

LULU: And they are—they are not found anywhere else in nature, just in human breast milk.

LATIF: Weird!

LULU: In fact, Avir calls them “alien sugars.”

LATIF: And that’s the number three ingredient in breast milk, alien sugar?

LULU: The third biggest, yeah.

AVIR: You can’t get them at the local grocery store. And what’s crazy about it is humans can’t digest this stuff at all. Like, literally no human being can do anything with these sugars. And no one ever really thought to ask, like, what’s going on, really, until a scientist by the name of Bruce German came along and basically just asked this simple question: Why? Why would a mother who’s got very precious, limited calories, why would that mother literally dissolve her own body, taking all these precious nutrients and calories to make milk that needs to feed this baby, why would the mom make these sugars that no baby can use? Why? So this is around 2005. Bruce is having these thoughts, and this is the era, sort of, of the microbiome, where we’re all thinking about the microbiome. And it’s this idea that, like, we’re basically human suits covered in bacteria, filled with bacteria.

LULU: [laughs]

AVIR: You know? And so he has this hunch that’s basically like, okay, well, if we can’t use it maybe there’s a bacteria that can.

LULU: In where?

AVIR: That lives inside of a baby. You know, maybe there’s a bacteria that lives in the baby.

LULU: All right. That would make sense. Like, food for our baby bacteria.

AVIR: Right.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: So they design an experiment basically taking an agar plate where bacteria like to grow.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: So they decide, “Okay, we’ll take the agar plate, sprinkle the alien sugars on a plate, and throw a bacteria in there and see if it grows.”

LULU: If you eat it, you’ll proliferate. If you don’t, you’re gonna die.

AVIR: Exactly.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: Yeah, you got it.

LULU: All right.

AVIR: So they throw some bacteria—you know, take a common bacteria that lives in the gut, throw it on there, throw some HMOs. It dies, doesn’t work, no luck.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: Try another one, no luck. Try a third one, no luck.

LULU: Okay, how long is this taking?

AVIR: Well, so a year goes by.

LULU: Yep.

AVIR: Bruce and his team are, like, begging, borrowing, stealing, to get, like, any breast milk that they can. You know, begging on the street. Like, “Can I get some?”

LULU: [laughs]

AVIR: You know, it’s not working. A year goes by. Two years go by.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: And finally on the third year—boom. They find something.

[suspenseful music]

AVIR: That was perfect.

LULU: Ooh!

AVIR: Wow. Why do we prep for these podcasts? We could just do this.

LULU: I know. Let’s just always do that. Okay.

AVIR: Okay, so they find something that’s growing. You could see all this white stuff is bacteria that’s growing.

LULU: At this point Avir shows us a picture of a plate with all this bacteria growing on it.

AVIR: Because they put it under a microscope, and it looks very strange.

LULU: Ooh!

LULU: If you zoom in on this picture, this collection of squiggles …

AVIR: Zoom in a little more.

LULU: It’s beautiful!

LULU: … becomes …

AVIR: Zoom in a little more.

LULU: … these individual little …

AVIR: A little more.

LULU: … Y shapes.

LULU: And so this is the bacteria that likes to eat the weird alien sugar in the breast milk?

AVIR: Exactly. And so it turns out this bacteria is called Bifidobacterium infantis.

LATIF: Bifidobacterium infantis. Never heard of it.

LULU: Mm-hmm. Yeah, we can just call it ‘Bifid’ for short. It is shaped like a Y, and with one of the little spires kind of bent over like a little puppy dog ear. It’s kinda cute. Anyway, this was the only bacteria they could find that actually ate those alien sugars in breast milk.

LATIF: Huh!

AVIR: Yeah. So, yeah.

LULU: Okay, so does that mean this is in my baby’s belly?

AVIR: Well, that’s the next question. Exactly right. So you have found, out of the thousands of bacteria, you found one that can eat these sugars. That’s crazy enough.

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: Because, like, you know, we don’t—we can’t eat them, but it has all the genes and all the enzymes to eat these sugars that we make that we can’t eat. It’s just weird, right?

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: So you would think okay, this—this should be in some babies’ guts.

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: And so the way to look for that is, you know, when you have bacteria in your gut, you’re gonna poop out some of that bacteria. So you really gotta get into poop. You know, that’s where this story is going. And so basically from there, Bruce and his team need to start collecting dirty diapers, you know? Which I don’t know if that’s an upgrade from begging for milk, but that’s where they’re at.

[laughter]

AVIR: So Bruce is working at UC Davis. He’s around getting his friends and neighbors and strangers on the street to give him their dirty diapers. “Let’s culture it. Let’s see if we can find some Bifid in there.”

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: But no, he can’t find any Bifid in any—in any of these diapers.

LULU: They’re just not—so that theory’s gone?

AVIR: Well, it might just be where they’re located, you know? So they realize they need

to sort of expand the search. And that’s where this idea starts, what I call the amazing global baby diaper hunt.

LULU: [laughs] Okay.

AVIR: So it turns out that the Gates Foundation, for some reason, has collected stool samples from all over the planet. I’m not sure why, but don’t tell Elon Musk about this please.

LULU: Basic science! You never know!

AVIR: So they have just baby poop, like—like, just lining their walls, I guess. I don’t know.

LULU: Just libraries of poop.

AVIR: Just libraries of poop from all over the world.

LULU: Okay. Yeah.

AVIR: So Bruce calls them, you know, sets up a meeting and says, “Can I get some of this? Let me get some of this poop!” So yeah, they set up a deal where he’s gonna—they’re gonna send him poop from all over the world. And they’re gonna look all over the place. So they look. They start looking at poop in Denmark.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: And no Bifid.

AVIR: Okay.

AVIR: Scandinavia, Switzerland. No—no Bifid.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: But then they get to Gambia.

LULU: Huh!

AVIR: Bifid. It’s there in the poop. Cambodia, it’s there. Rural China, Bangladesh. They have Bifid.

LULU: Huh!

AVIR: Weirdly, the only people in the US? Mennonites.

LULU: Mennonites have the Bifid? The babies have it?

AVIR: Very strange.

LULU: Why some places and not others?

AVIR: Well, that’s the question. At this time, they don’t really know why here, why not there?

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: It’s a mystery. I mean, it certainly could be—you know, maybe this bacteria survives in a certain climate. Maybe it’s genetic differences, maybe it’s lifestyle differences. It’s an open question.

LULU: Okay. Does he have any guesses of—like, there’s obviously some bacteria we

like that are great for gut health, some we don’t want. Is it—does he have any

sense of what it’s actually doing?

AVIR: Right. That’s the next question is Bruce and the team, guy by the name of David Mills, all these amazing scientists want to figure out, what is this bacteria doing?

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: So what they do is they do another experiment. They basically take some cells from the gut which you can take. You can culture them and you can put them on a plate. And when you put gut cells on a plate, they actually automatically form themselves into a wall. And so it’s kind of cool because, you know, gut cells, what they’re supposed to do is basically form a wall, and anything you eat or drink has to basically go through those cells to get to your body. So it wants to make sure all the food is the right food. It’s all broken down properly. All the good stuff comes in, all the bad stuff stays out. That’s what the gut cells do. So they form into this wall. A gut’s being formed in a petri dish. They throw some Bifidobacterium on the petri dish and see what happens.

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: And right away they notice that the bacteria are able to sort of latch onto the walls of the gut, just, like, hang there like mountain climbers. And they start proliferating really fast and basically coating the whole wall.

LULU: Whoa! So this Y-shaped bacteria that likes alien sugars with enough time will—it’s almost like wallpaper on the inside of the baby’s gut?

AVIR: Yeah, exactly. It’s like wallpaper on the walls.

LULU: Okay. So I guess I ask again, is this a good—is this a good thing?

AVIR: Right. We don’t know, like, if it’s good or not.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: So to answer that …

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: I gotta tell you a story.

LULU: Okay. I love a story.

AVIR: All right, so Dylan—guys, I’m gonna need a little bit of, like—rogue, don’t try this at home—just don’t try this type of stuff at home.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: So our story centers around Dr. Shara Sheldon, who at the time is a PhD student, okay? Now she’s studying this stuff. She goes to a lecture where Bruce is talking about these results, and it sticks in the back of her mind. Meanwhile, her father is a professor at the vet school, and he works at a lab—like, at the—not at a lab at a barn that’s raising these thoroughbred horses.

LULU: Ooh. Okay!

AVIR: So thoroughbred horses, if you don’t know, you know, those are those really expensive horses that—you know, they eat way better food than you and I.

LULU: [laughs] Yeah.

AVIR: Their lives are definitely more valuable than ours.

LULU: For sure.

AVIR: Like, these are expensive …

LULU: Fine. Yeah. Okay.

AVIR: But there’s a problem at the barn. Every new foal that’s being born to these horses, after a few days is getting diarrhea, fevers, and then dying.

LULU: Oh!

AVIR: Yeah. And that’s sad because we like horses, but also sad because they’re losing, like, hundreds of thousands of dollars every time this happens.

LULU: On every foal. Okay. Okay.

AVIR: And the problem is next week there’s gonna be, like, 20 more foals being born.

LULU: Oh, no!

AVIR: And yeah, so basically what they do is they find out what’s going on, and it turns out these horses are infested with, like, one of the worst diarrheal bacteria that we have. And if anyone works—does anyone work in healthcare or anything like that? I mean, what’s the one bacteria—diarrheal illness that we don’t want to deal with?

AUDIENCE MEMBER: C. diff.

AVIR: C. diff, exactly.

LULU: C. diff.

AVIR: You know it. Once you’ve smelled C. diff once you’ll never forget. I mean …

LULU: Avir showed a picture of C. diff that was right behind us on stage.

LULU: Okay, it looks like a dynamite stick, like, exploding corn dog situation.

AVIR: Yes, the corn dog dynamite stick. This bacteria is terrible.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: Like, you can’t—if you spray this with antiseptic, if you spray it with Purell, like, it won’t die. Like, this thing doesn’t die.

LULU: Yikes!

AVIR: It’s really hard—needs very strong antibiotics.

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: It kills people all the time.

LULU: Oh, no!

AVIR: We see this every time in the hospital. And it was killing these horses, so these foals infested with C. diff. The dad, who’s the professor who works there, is talking to his daughter about it and commiserating. And the daughter goes, “Wait, like, I just heard a lecture by this guy, Bruce German.”

LULU: Oh, no.

AVIR: “And he was talking about this bacteria that coats the walls. Like, let’s give this to the horses.”

[laughter]

AVIR: So—so the dad goes, “Yeah. I mean, let’s try it.” So they take the bacteria from Bruce, they culture it, they mix it up with some milk.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: And then when the foal is just born, they squirt it into the foal’s mouth.

LULU: Like with a little baby bottle?

AVIR: Yeah, a little baby—squirt it in.

LULU: Hope for the best, it’s only $100,000 on the line.

AVIR: Right.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: And lo and behold, what happens is sure enough, 20 foals are born, none of them get C. diff, all of them do fine.

LULU: Whoa!

AVIR: Incredible.

LULU: We—go—can we get a round of applause for Shara?

AVIR: Rebel science.

LULU: Again, don’t try it at home. Like, clinical trials are good, but ingenuity, okay.

AVIR: So I want to play my interview with her, because I wish I could tell you the story stopped there, but it continues on.

LULU: Oh.

AVIR: All right. Let’s see.

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Shara Sheldon: I was like, “Good job, brain, for remembering the random lecture with Bruce German.”]

LULU: So in the room we’re actually now watching a video of the interview where you can see Shara on the left—put together, short dark hair. And Avir on the right is, like, kinda sweaty and, like, was just saving lives, maybe.

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Avir: There are so many random lectures I had in med school that I will never remember. Like, I don’t know how you did that.]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Shara Sheldon: I loved it, though. I thought it was the neatest thing. I don’t know.]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Avir: Okay, so that’s an amazing story, but I know that the story doesn’t end there. What happens next?]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Shara Sheldon: So time goes on. I’m still doing my PhD, and got married, got pregnant, and then I had my baby—healthy baby. Everything’s going great and then the change comes. And we started dealing with a lot of gas, a lot of crying. Just—like, he looked like he was in pain. We were trying everything for the gas—the little gas drops that are natural, the bicycle kicks, all kinds of things. So I just was getting quite desperate to find something that would work. And we kind of hit the breaking point when my husband was out of town. And so I’m alone with the baby, and it was so bad. He was up, like, all night, just in pain, gassy. And I was like, “This is not going to work.” And I said, “We need something.” And so I remembered the Bifidobacterium. And I said, “I’m going to email Bruce.” And so I sent a desperate email saying, “Please, please, I know you have some of this Bifidobacterium still. Like, I’d really like to try it.”]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Avir: Okay, and so does he email back? Like, does he take a week to email back?]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Shara Sheldon: He got back to me right away, and he said, “You can drive up and get it.” And I loaded up in the car, drove to Davis, and went in. And we got, like, a little bag, just a brown paper bag, with samples in there and this syringe.]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Avir: No way. What, they’re in, like, little vials or something, or like …?]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Shara Sheldon: No, they’re in little sachets. Like a little rectangular packet that you, like, can rip across and pour out.]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Avir: Oh. Okay, yeah, I got it.]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Shara Sheldon: So, I was like …]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Avir: Like a bag of drugs, basically.]

[laughter]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Shara Sheldon: Yeah. You know, you’re using stuff that’s being tested for research, so it’s not very pretty.]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Avir: Right.]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Shara Sheldon: I get home, I’m very excited to try this. I grab one of the little sachet packets out, and I open it and I see there’s, like, a powder in there. It had kind of an interesting odor, I noticed. And then I mix it in with the breast milk and then suck it up in the syringe. And then my mom helps me hold Connor and we hold his head and we put the syringe into his mouth, squirt it in. So we did that. And they said, “Just do one dose a day.” So, you know, I’m sitting there with baited breath, waiting to see if anything happens, watching him like a hawk. We didn’t really see any changes right away, so I was a little disappointed because you’re desperate at this point, right? I want results. I’m so tired.]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Avir: Right.]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Shara Sheldon: And it took two days. So—and then it worked.]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Avir: Oh, wow. Okay. What do you mean it worked? Like …?]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Shara Sheldon: It—the change was just so drastic. It was like a switch had clicked. And he just was so much happier. He was sleeping. He wouldn’t have the gas constantly, and just seemed so much more relaxed. And I just—I was like, “This is working.” And this is exactly what was missing from his microbiota.]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Avir: Well, you know, the scientist in me has to ask, like, you know, could this have just been a coincidence, you know, like, or placebo effect? You know, obviously you really wanted to see some results. Like, how do you know—how do you know for sure that this did that?]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Shara Sheldon: I would be doing the same thing, right? “Oh, this is just a placebo.” But the amount of dirty diapers had been very consistent. I had been keeping track because I love data and I’m a nerd, so I was keeping track of all of these things. And to go from, like, that eight to eleven down to two, I knew it was doing something.]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Avir: Wow, that’s—I gotta say—I mean like, was there ever a part of you that felt, like, afraid to essentially be, like, experimenting on your firstborn child? Or did you just feel that confident?]

[laughter]

[ARCHIVE CLIP, Shara Sheldon: I mean, I felt really confident with it. And there’s a small part of you that’s like, “Oh yeah, I’m giving this novel thing to my baby.” But when I saw all the benefit, it was like, “This is right, and it’s working and everything’s good.” But it is scary.]

LULU: Oh, wow! As a—I just have to say, is there any other, like, better image of sleep deprivation than, like, “This thing smelled a little weird, but let’s put it down.” Wow! Okay, go Shara. I mean, what—okay, but to follow up on your—your question there, like, do we know what it—like, is there still a chance that could have been placebo? Do we have any clue about what’s actually happening at the cellular level? Like, what is going on?

AVIR: Yeah, so Bruce sort of made a deal with Shara. Like, “I’ll give you the bacteria, you give me his diapers.”

LULU: [laughs] Okay.

AVIR: Common theme we’re seeing emerge here. So that’s what he does. He sort of collects Connor’s diapers—and a bunch of other kids’ too—and he’s sort of seeing what’s going on. “Let’s check the microbiome, let’s check the stool, see what’s happening.”

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: Let’s look for a subtle change, like a change of five, ten percent in your microbiome, I mean, that’s huge.

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: But what he finds is actually Connor’s diapers went from having zero Bifidobacterium to being 80 percent Bifidobacterium.

LULU: Whoa!

AVIR: And this is, like, insane, because, you know, it’s not—we’re not even—this isn’t normal microbiome stuff. This isn’t, like, diverse ecosystem. This is just like domination by one bacterium.

LULU: It’s like a monoculture in there.

AVIR: Yeah, exactly.

LULU: It’s all Bifid. Wow!

AVIR: Yeah. Okay, so they notice that, and that’s interesting. Another thing they notice as well, is just like babies eat and they poop, well, these bacterias are eating these alien sugars and they have to poop, too.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: But what they’re seeing is the poop that these bacteria are creating are acid. So they’re creating acidic poop. And the thing is bacteria can’t really grow that well in acid, so acid prevents bacteria—most bacteria from growing.

LULU: Oh!

AVIR: And it turns out that Bifidobacterium is totally chilling in the acid, but the idea is it may be keeping other bacteria away.

LATIF: Okay. Can I—can I just make sure I understand what’s going on?

LULU: Absolutely.

LATIF: Okay, so Bifid is the thing that eats the weird sugar in breast milk.

LULU: Mm-hmm.

LATIF: And if you put it in a baby’s gut it’ll receive that sugar, it’ll eat the sugar, it’ll bloom and it’ll wallpaper the gut, but also it’ll, like, edge out all the other bacteria.

LULU: With its acid poop, yes.

LATIF: With its acid. Right.

LULU: Bully wallpaper, kind of. [laughs]

LATIF: Okay. And the idea is that the bully wallpaper is what helped Shara’s baby have less gas and less pooping pain or whatever?

LULU: Yeah. I mean, we don’t know what was happening inside Shara’s baby for sure, but that is exactly Bruce German’s theory. And, you know, Avir pointed out there’s a lot of situations, especially in a newly-developing baby gut, that if the wrong kinds of bacteria get in there it can release toxins and poke holes in the gut wall.

AVIR: And allow things to pass through. Instead of going through the cells, they sort of go in between the cells and around the cells. So bacteria can get in, toxins can get in, undigested food particles can get in.

LULU: Ugh!

AVIR: And that’s called “leaky gut.”

LATIF: Leaky gut.

LULU: Yeah. And according to Avir, that can cause a lot more problems than just gas pain or diarrhea.

AVIR: And for this baby that just got an immune system, like, two months ago, it’s trying to figure out what the hell is going on, and it gets very overwhelmed and confused. It gets inflamed. The immune system is hyperactivated, and it causes a lot—you know, it can cause a lot of problems.

LULU: So Bruce’s theory is that, you know, going back to Bifid coating the walls of the gut …

AVIR: When Bifidobacterium’s here, the Bifidobacterium sticks to the walls, prevents any other bacteria from coming there, so that basically nothing bad gets into the body.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: And the immune system can actually, like, learn and do its thing.

LATIF: And to be clear, so this is a bacteria that most babies, especially here in the US right now do not have.

LULU: Exactly. And what’s wild is that you can actually see the disappearance over time, because if you look back over time at poop samples from across the world—which there are—one of Bruce’s grad students at the time actually did this, Bethany Henrich, she looked at the historical data and found that baby poop back in the early 1900s, it used to be way more acidic, like, everywhere.

LATIF: Whoa! It’s just been subtly changing all this time?

LULU: Yeah, over the last hundred years. In places like the US, it started trending over to neutral.

AVIR: There’s this very clear line, and it’s showing that basically our baby’s poop used to be acidic to a pH of five, which is acidic.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: And it’s slowly been working its way up to neutral. And it’s like this very clear thing if you map it out.

LULU: Huh! And again, you said the Bifid makes the acidic poop, so watching it get less acidic, is that like watching a disappearance?

AVIR: Exactly.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: At this point, Bruce and the team is sort of being like, “Wait, this is a sign. This is the marker of Bifid, and it’s going away.”

LULU: Huh.

AVIR: That’s what they see.

LATIF: Wow, this feels—you’re making me, like, miss this thing. Like, I feel like we should get it back.

LULU: Yeah, well that is where we are going next in the show. First we’re gonna take a brief intermission, but when we come back we will not only address that, we’re gonna have special guests live on stage, we’re gonna hear about cease and desist orders from the FDA coming down to doctors, and we’re gonna be doing some real life I guess you could call it experimentation on the audience.

LATIF: On babies?

LULU: Not babies. On adults in the bar.

LATIF: [laughs] Okay.

LULU: Stick with us!

LULU: Okay.

LATIF: Okay. Latif.

LULU: Lulu.

LATIF: Radiolab.

LULU: We are back, playing the live show I did with Avir Mitra, telling the story of this baby gut bacterium that seems to be protecting the baby’s gut. And we didn’t delve into this much, but feeding the baby’s gut cells, keeping them going strong, but also appears to be disappearing from our species all over. And according to Bruce German, our main scientist, it is time to bring Bifid back.

AVIR: At this point, Bruce goes from being, like, just a normal scientist—show up to work, do your research—to becoming like a borderline evangelist.

LULU: [laughs] Okay.

AVIR: Like, he—you know, his daughters won’t take him to the family dinners because this is, like, all he talks about. He told me that.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: You know, he’s like, he sees a baby in a stroller across the street, he’s gonna, like, sprint over to the baby, throw some Bifidobacterium at them. And he actually mortgages his house and gets his co-workers to do the same. They sell the boat, do all these things to start their own startup to sell Bifidobacterium.

LULU: Whoa!

AVIR: Right.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: Which you can buy and which we may or may not have …

LULU: Ooh!

AVIR: … for you to try.

LULU: And this is just like he’s selling bacteria in a jar?

AVIR: Bacteria in a jar.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: Yeah.

LULU: Okay, now at this point in the show, I just need to pop out and say Avir told a story that honestly I have not been able to shake since that night. And it’s kind of like the story of Shara and her baby, but on steroids. And it starts when Bruce and his team connect with a guy named Brian Scadalini.

AVIR: Brian Scadalini is an MD/PhD, and he’s a neonatologist who works at OHSU in Portland. So he’s working there, and as a neonatologist, it’s a beautiful thing because you get to see these little tiny preemies grow into, like, full-fledged adults. But there is one thing that’s, like, the worst thing that happens in NICUs, and basically that’s this.

LULU: So Avir was showing us this picture. It’s like a CT scan kind of thing, and you can sort of tell that it’s like this scan of a gut, but it seems to be, like, almost ballooned out.

AVIR: So what we’re looking at is a preemie’s belly.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: And it’s filled with gas, it’s very distended. And this baby’s not doing well. This is called “necrotizing enterocolitis,” also known as NEC. And basically what’s going on is, like, a bacteria, an adult bacteria has somehow made its way into the baby’s gut, has sort of bloomed and taken over, and is, like, completely destroying the gut wall, producing all this gas and all these bad things.

LULU: Huh. That looks painful, scary. I mean …

AVIR: Very scary.

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: Yeah. I mean, when I was a resident, I rotated in NICUs, and it’s terrifying, because these preemies can go from being normal, and then overnight they can totally crash and get this. And the mortality is very high once they get this.

LULU: Oh yikes!

AVIR: So Brian gets sort of wind of this bacteria, and they both have this thought, “Well, maybe we could try Bifidobacterium.”

LULU: In—in the preemies?

AVIR: In the preemies.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: He gets some of the Bifidobacterium from Bruce and the team and the company, and he just starts giving this to the babies.

LULU: Without checking with parents or …

AVIR: Right. Pretty much like, “This is on formulary now. We’re gonna give it to them.”

LULU: I’m having mixed emotions about this idea. But …

AVIR: Sure.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: Yeah, I agree.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: And, you know, you gotta think he’s not just waiting until they get NEC to give it to them. He’s giving it to all the preemies, like even the ones that would be fine without it.

LULU: It’s like a preventative measure.

AVIR: Preventative. Exactly, preventative.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: And lo and behold, he finds that the incidents of NEC goes from 11 percent down to 2 percent.

LULU: It was actually 2.7 percent.

AVIR: Insane!

LULU: That’s huge.

AVIR: Yeah.

LULU: Okay.

[applause]

AVIR: And this goes on for years.

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: There is, in fact, years that go by that they don’t see a single incidence of this.

LULU: Of NEC in the NICU?

AVIR: Right. In the NICU. He publishes about it, gains some momentum.

LULU: And he’s sprinkling Bifid this whole time?

AVIR: Yeah, just sprinkling.

LULU: Okay. Okay.

AVIR: This was in—well, he’s—we’ll get to that. So he does this and yeah, he finds that it’s working. Other NICUs are starting to take this up.

LULU: Okay.

AVIR: So anyway, I’ve been talking about Brian enough. I want to bring Brian up himself. So Brian, if you’re here, let’s bring you up.

LULU: All right. Let’s get some play-on music. Come on down!

AVIR: Thank you, Brian.

BRIAN SCADALINI: Hi everybody.

AVIR: You just flew in today, just landed.

BRIAN SCADALINI: I did.

AVIR: So you had this really incredible result when you studied Bifidobacterium. I mean, truly incredible, and it seemed like it was spreading. But I guess I wanted to ask you, like, what happened next?

BRIAN SCADALINI: Well as—as Avir was saying, for years our incidents of necrotizing enterocolitis was quite low. And so we started in 2018 to answer that question, and then we had to stop in 2023.

AVIR: Tell me about that.

BRIAN SCADALINI: So for years, even well before me, neonatal intensive care units throughout the world, in Europe and in Australia, almost every premature baby gets a probiotic, gets a bacteria that is like this, including this one, Bifidobacterium infantis, to prevent necrotizing enterocolitis. So I wasn’t as crazy as it might have sounded to start using it in our NICU.

AVIR: A little crazy. A little crazy.

BRIAN SCADALINI: But we were the first ones to use it alone. So our team decided this bacteria makes sense because of its symbiosis with milk, and so we thought we should use this to prevent necrotizing enterocolitis. But what happened, as you might expect, whenever you introduce a bacterium into somebody, whether it’s us or babies, and especially babies with an immature immune system, there is a risk that it will find its way into their bloodstream.

BRIAN SCADALINI: Now if you ask me if I’m gonna choose between a pathogen and Bifidobacterium infantis, which has no antibiotic resistance, and is meant to be in milk or in the gut to metabolize HMOs—which cannot be metabolized by us, remember that—I will choose B. infantis. And so unfortunately, some babies got B. infantis in their bloodstream and had positive blood cultures, meaning that when they looked ill, they had a blood—a sample of blood taken and then was grown to see if the infantis was there.

BRIAN SCADALINI: I might add that other bacteria that have been used as probiotics have also found their way into the bloodstream. The FDA knew that NICUs throughout the United States were using this to prevent necrotizing enterocolitis, and decided with the instance of a bloodstream infection, that all the NICUs in the United States needed to stop using probiotics to prevent necrotizing enterocolitis. This is essentially what’s like a cease-and-desist letter. You can read this letter and see there isn’t a risk department in a hospital that’s gonna continue to use this with the FDA saying, “You shall not use this without an investigational new drug status.”

AVIR: So you get this letter, and I imagine you have some complicated feelings, because it’s like—I don’t know, we could understand where the FDA is coming from.

LULU: I’m a little onside FDA.

AVIR: But at the same time, you’re working hands on with these babies and you’re seeing amazing results. So, like, what’s going through your mind?

BRIAN SCADALINI: The first was, “Oh, crap,” but a stronger word than that, because in the risk-benefit, we saw necrotizing enterocolitis, we’d get two or three babies die per year, and for several years, no baby that was born in our hospital died from necrotizing enterocolitis. So on one hand, I felt like babies were going to die now. I—I hate this disease, I can’t tell you how much I hate this disease, and I hate seeing babies die in four hours, six hours, they’re dead. And the impact it has on their parents, versus a rare risk like this. So that was going through my mind. But on the other hand, it was sort of like what you were talking about Lulu. It was sort of like, well, we were using something to treat, prevent or mitigate a disease, which is a drug. And therefore I see the FDA’s point. So I was of split minds.

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: What happened once you removed this bacteria?

BRIAN SCADALINI: Unfortunately, we are working on reporting this, but our necrotizing enterocolitis rate has come right back to where it was before, in fact, probably a little bit higher than it was before.

AVIR: So I guess where do you go from here? What are you trying to do now?

BRIAN SCADALINI: Well, we suspect this is happening throughout the United States, so we hope to be one of the first to report this. But since that time, we’ve been working with the FDA to try to have this become a drug, which is not the most simple pathway, and costs a lot of money to develop a drug. Investors are scared of premature babies. They’re afraid of pediatrics in general, and they’re really afraid of preterm babies, and so it’s a struggle to try to make this continue to move forward. And the only thing that keeps the folks who work on it working on it as a large team is the fact that at least in our hands it works.

AVIR: Okay, Brian, stay here on stage. Thanks, Brian, for being here.

LULU: Yeah.

[applause]

AVIR: Okay, so just to advance the story from here, Brian gets this result. Bruce has this company. He still really believes in it, but unfortunately his company sort of now has a scarlet A, and they have to sort of short sell to stay afloat. And so they lose—Bruce and his team sort of lose stake in the company. They’re still—you know, he still has his job. He’s not, like, on the streets, but things aren’t looking too good. So—but Bruce still—and I’ve spoken to Bruce for hours. He’s still positive about it, he’s still hopeful. And so anyway, I’ve been gatekeeping this guy Bruce long enough. Let’s bring him up to the stage, Bruce German.

LULU: Bruce!

AVIR: Hi.

LULU: Okay, Bruce, I’ve got a question. Going all the way back to that global poop hunt—I don’t know if that’s what you called it in your papers, but our shorthand—do we have any clue, like, why in the places like Denmark and most of the US, except the Mennonite communities and Switzerland—like, why—where was the Bifid going? Why did we lose it if it seems like it is such a harmonious thing in a baby gut?

BRUCE GERMAN: First I should say that—that this is the work of literally over a hundred people for 20 years. And I know I’m obviously distractingly tall and good-looking.

LULU: [laughs]

BRUCE GERMAN: But really, it’s this diversity of scientists from around the campus of UC-Davis who have brought this science forward. And that’s one of the critical questions where you need multiple disciplines. Because it’s a mutualism, what we would call a synergy. Oligosaccharides don’t do much by themselves. The baby poops them out. Bifidobacterium infantis doesn’t do much all by itself. The baby poops it out. But you put them together and that’s the magic, and away it goes. But babies are born sterile.

LULU: Completely? No microbiome in there?

BRUCE GERMAN: They’re sterile. Mother, you are keeping your baby sterile.

LULU: Huh!

BRUCE GERMAN: But needless to say, the minute they’re born, they are being inoculated from bacteria all over.

LULU: Wow.

BRUCE GERMAN: If there is no Bifidobacteria infantis in their environment, they cannot get Bifidobacteria infantis.

LULU: Hmm.

BRUCE GERMAN: If mothers can’t breastfeed, then they don’t get the oligosaccharides. They don’t survive. No Bifidobacteria in the baby.

LULU: No fish food for the bacteria.

BRUCE GERMAN: No. Nothing. If the mother gets antibiotics, kills Bifidobacteria, and that mother will never have Bifidobacteria again, unless she somehow gets re-inoculated. One step in any of those directions ends the story, and it’s been happening over a century. Mothers are losing the ability to pass on the bacteria.

AVIR: You know, you—another part of this is formula doesn’t have these alien sugars.

BRUCE GERMAN: No.

AVIR: And it’s not able to feed these bacteria, so the bacteria get starved. And I will say, you won’t admit this but, you know, part of his evangelism was that he would email all the formula makers, and be like, “Can I meet with you?” And he would get some meetings with these formula makers. And my impression was they were sort of like, “Thank you, sir. Here’s security, please leave.”

[laughter]

AVIR: I’m exaggerating. But lo and behold, a few years ago, all the major formula makers have added these alien sugars into the formula. I’m crediting you with that.

BRUCE GERMAN: I mean, it turns out that there are dozens.

LULU: That’s great. That’s great!

[applause]

BRUCE GERMAN: There are dozens of different oligosaccharides. And so far, industrially they can only make a couple. And you need a lot. Remember you pointed out there’s more of this than protein. Evolution is saying it’s as important to feed the bacteria in the baby as the baby.

AVIR: Right.

BRUCE GERMAN: So—so we need to get a lot more.

AVIR: Okay. Well, I think one question I had is sort of, you know, you look at the pH changing and the poops changing over the centuries. Like, I can’t help but think this correlates so well with the rise of, like, childhood autoimmune diseases and, like, these chronic diseases. I just wanted to—is there something there?

BRUCE GERMAN: Yeah, we’ve been studying that, and the strength of the immune system is it’s so personal. The benefit of that is your immune system can learn to attack diseases your parents never had. There’s a flaw—is your immune system has to develop, be educated in the first few weeks of life. And the immune system is basically located in your gut, for sort of obvious reasons. It’s paying attention to the environment through the bacteria. If the bacteria are appropriate—Bifidobacterium infantis—then it’s clear that the immune system is developing appropriately. But if the gut is full of inappropriate bacteria, now the immune system is being miseducated. The result of that is, with Bifidobacterium infantis, it’s clear, it’s an intelligent immune system. If it doesn’t, then it’s not an intelligent immune system.

AVIR: What does that mean, “intelligent immune system?”

BRUCE GERMAN: It makes mistakes. So an immune system can make two kinds of mistakes. It can say, “There is danger. Don’t worry about it.” The other kind of mistake is, “It’s perfectly benign. I should attack it as if it was dangerous.” And that’s what—autoimmune disease. When someone doesn’t have Bifidobacterium infantis, their immune system is not developing appropriately. That means it’s greater risk. Doesn’t mean they’re gonna get autoimmune disease but they’re at greater risk of having it. We now have very convincing data that a part of the problem with autoimmune disease is the bacteria in your gut in this early developmental stage—and lo and behold, throughout human history, Bifidobacterium infantis, that’s been the one. It’s been predicted that if we had not found it, it would probably have been extinct within the next generation. It wouldn’t have been findable at all in—in a few years.

AVIR: You know, I just think it’s crazy that there’s this, like, Y-shaped bacteria, right? That no one ever paid attention to, that we almost wiped off the face of the Earth by accident, that basically has this completely symbiotic relationship with us. I mean, like, you know, we—obviously in school we learn about, like, the birds and the bees and pollination and coral and algae. But, like, who knew that, like, our babies have symbiotic relationships with this random bacteria? Like that’s Sylvie. That’s Lulu’s baby.

LULU: My baby.

AVIR: Like, Sylvie is a symbiote with these bacteria. I mean, it’s blowing my mind. And if you really think back, like, if you really go back in time, let’s go back 500,000 years, which is when we broke off to become human. Bruce was telling me, if you go back, you know, to trace the genetic lineage of Bifidobacterium infantis, it broke off from its predecessor at exactly the same time. Which to me is crazy, because that means, like, we have literally co-evolved with this bacteria. I mean, like, come on! Like, this is our best friend. This is, like, our oldest and best friend that we’ve ever had.

LULU: Okay Avir, can we—can we—sorry, can we scratch the emo music? Okay, I mean, you—you put a picture of my baby up, and it’s a beautiful thought but we’re tell—you’ve gathered, like, a sad story here. I mean, Brian was shut down, the study was shut down, who knows how long—if it’s ever gonna go. I mean, Bruce is eloquent, but his business sounds kind of on the rocks.

[laughter]

LULU: And I feel like—and then, even if we could get it back, there are all kinds of parents who can’t breastfeed for different reasons—economic reasons, body reasons, whatever it may be. So, like, aren’t we just being kept away from this majestic, beautiful friend? Aren’t we just—isn’t this just sad? And we’re doomed to be unhealthy?

BRUCE GERMAN: Got it. At this point in time, no.

LULU: Okay.

BRUCE GERMAN: If you look back at the history of scientific discoveries, especially related to health, they’re always turbulent. This is a fundamentally different way of thinking. It’s now been shown that babies with Bifidobacterium infantis respond better to a vaccine than babies who haven’t. So that’s not just protection, that’s enhancing health in ways we didn’t even think about before. If you look back how science moves, it’s moving inexorably forward. It’s just a matter of time.

LULU: Okay, this guy can milk hope out of any situation, I guess.

[laughter]

AVIR: Another pun. Well, I guess with that, you know, we only have one thing left to do, honestly, is we have the Bifidobacterium here. We’re gonna try some.

LULU: Yeah.

AVIR: No pressure obviously, but if you guys want to try some we can all cheers to Bifid together. Just talk to your bartender. They’re gonna be bringing them out.

LULU: Okay we’re gonna start passing it. Raise your hand if you want it. Once again, you do not have to. Radiolab doesn’t necessarily condone it.

LATIF: Wait, you had the Bifid there? Was it—was it alive?

LULU: Yeah, it was the real stuff. It’ll bloom if you drink it. It was like in these little bags. It’s kind of this—just like the smelly powders that Shara had.

LATIF: Wow! What did it smell like?

LULU: It was like fishtank-lite?

LATIF: [laughs]

LULU: You know?

LATIF: Sure!

LULU: And we mixed it in with some water, and handed out shots.

LATIF: Oh, wow!

LULU: To anyone who wanted. And while we were handing out these little shot cups, I made the band jam out along with …

LULU: And I think we need to bring in an instrument that has never been played on Radiolab ever before. Hold on. Can you mic me? Okay.

LULU: … my breastbone.

LATIF: Wow!

LULU: Okay. So, okay.

AVIR: Breastbone remix.

LULU: Come forward.

LULU: It was not hooked up. It was not all the way hooked up.

LATIF: You weren’t pumping.

LULU: I wasn’t actually pumping milk.

AVIR: It’s very goth—industrial goth vibe.

LULU: Yeah, it’s a little steampunk. Oh my God, this sound, again and again. Why capitalism, why?

AVIR: Don’t drink it yet. We’re gonna drink it together. We’re gonna drink it together.

LULU: We’re gonna do it together.

LATIF: Did people want it, actually?

LULU: A lot of people. Yeah, I think most people did it.

AVIR: Turn that music down. All right, cheers, everyone.

LULU: Cheers! Okay, we really do it? Okay.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: What did we actually drink just now?

LULU: Straight up bacteria. Who just asked? Yeah, you just ingested, like—I don’t know—is it powder? Dried bacteria? It’s those little Y-shapes. What did we drink, Bruce?

BRUCE GERMAN: Yeah, Bifidobacterium longum, subspecies infantis.

LULU: Okay.

LULU: Like, as I drank this stuff down, I thought about how we were all in the room at that moment literally physically reuniting with this bacteria that we have been with for so long, that we might be starting to lose. But the more I started thinking about that whole chain of things that Bifid do in a baby’s body, I realized I actually had one last question for Bruce.

LULU: So this is sort of an emotional question, but in this moment of breastfeeding, which I have found to be one of the most, like, connecting experiences of my life, you’re saying what’s happening is the baby, which used to be inside me is learning—it’s building itself away from me, from other things. Like, it’s actually a physiological moment of a wall being built of disconnection.

BRUCE GERMAN: [laughs] Well, it’s true, but …

LULU: Okay.

[laughter]

BRUCE GERMAN: But you’re paying forward so that that infant can be successful. The genius of milk is we tended to think milk is protective. Of course. Darwin, survival. It’s more than that. Evolution is driving not just survival, it’s success lifelong. What you’re doing is providing the means for your baby to be successful its whole life.

LULU: Yeah, blah blah blah. Give ’em roots and wings so they can fly away. I only heard the first part, I’m sad. Go evolution. Okay.

LATIF: Well, despite your sadness, that story was great. That was a really fun event. I never heard any of that. Thank you for playing it for us. And thank you also to Avir and to Bifid.

LULU: Yes. And, you know, I should say this was not our first live show that we have done with Avir. You, of course, did one last summer called “How to Save a Life.”

LATIF: Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was the CPR one.

LULU: Mm-hmm.

LATIF: And we—that was also a blast. It also ended with music. We had the entire audience learning how to do CPR at the end to the perfect beats per minute of “Stayin’ Alive.”

LULU: Mm-hmm. They’ve been really, really fun, and we are thinking of these live shows with Avir as a series that we’re calling Viscera.

LATIF: Mm-hmm.

LULU: Because every story is about something going on in your body, in your viscera, and it will have some kind of visceral experience.

LATIF: Yeah, so if you do—if you do have a body, want to learn more about it, keep an eye out. We’ll, like—maybe we’re coming to a city near you.

LULU: Yup!

LATIF: And last thing, thanks, Lulu. We gotta do the thanks.

LULU: No, we already did them on stage.

LULU: Okay. Well, it is time now …

LATIF: All right, no problem. Okay, my work day is done.

LULU: [laughs]

LULU: As someone once said, if you want to hide a piece of information, put it in the credits to a podcast, because no one will listen. And yet you’re all stuck here! So okay, so huge thank you—he’s not even on here, but to Avir Mitra for bringing us this story.

[applause]

LULU: To Bruce German, to Brian Scadalini, right here on stage, too. Shara Sheldon and all her hijinks. To our musicians, Dylan Keefe and Ivan Baren. Biggest thank you to the Radiolab team lurking in the background. Stand up. Harry Fortuna, Sarah Sandbach, Soren Wheeler, Pat Walters, Anisa Vietze, Jeremy Bloom and George Wellington.

LULU: Speaking of Radiolab, I would like two OG members, Robert Krulwich and Ellen Horne to stand up—our original executive producer. They are here. We love you. None of us would be here without you. Everybody here at Caveat, thank you for bringing us here. Tip your waiters, order more drinks. We would love to come back. And finally, of course, to our Radiolab members who sat—there are people watching us on a screen. Hi! In fact, they’re still there. Thanks. You make everything we do possible. And now, Avir, you have a couple, and I need someone else to read the very last thing. We need a listener. Anyone? An audience member willing to—okay, come on down.

AVIR: So, quick thank-yous. This story actually came to me from a Radiolab listener named Tim Brown. So cool. So thanks to him for sharing this story. David Mills, Carlito Lebrilla, Bethany Henrik, Danielle Lemay, Katie Hinde, Jennifer Smilowitz, Angela Zivkovic, Daniela Barile and Mark Underwood—all the scientists involved in this research that I wasn’t able to shout out before.

LISTENER: Hi. I’m Alexa Petrie and I’m from Halifax, Nova Scotia and here are the staff credits. Radiolab was created by Jad Abumrad, and is edited by Soren Wheeler. Lulu Miller and Latif Nasser are our co-hosts. Dylan Keefe is our director of sound design. Our staff includes Simon Adler, Jeremy Bloom, Becca Bressler, W. Harry Fortuna, David Gebel, Maria Paz Gutiérrez, Sindhu Gnanasambandan, Matt Kielty, Annie McEwen, Alex Neason, Sarah Qari, Sarah Sandbach, Anisa Vietze, Arianne Wack, Pat Walters and Molly Webster. Our fact-checkers are Diane Kelly, Emily Krieger, and Natalie Middleton.

[applause]

LULU: Well done! Thank you all!

AVIR: Thank you so much!

LULU: Have a great night!

[LISTENER: Hi, this is Laura calling from Cleveland, Ohio. Leadership support for Radiolab’s science programming is provided by the Simons Foundation and the John Templeton Foundation. Foundational support for Radiolab was provided by the Alfred P. Sloan Foundation.]


-30-

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 New York Public Radio transcripts are created on a rush deadline, often by contractors. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of programming is the audio record.

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24-3-02379-7 Urajhia Leyaona Bailey v Michael Javon Agosto

Pierce County Superior Court Civil Case 24-3-02379-7 Purchase Copies 
Case Title:AURAJHIA LEYAONA BAILEY VS. MICHAEL JAVON AGOSTO
Case Type:Parenting Plan\Child Support
Access:Public
Track Assignment:Res Schedule-Parenting Plan
Jury Size:
Estimated Trial Length:
Dept Judge:FAMILY COURT – 1
Resolution:
Completion:
 Litigants
NameTypeStatus 
BAILEY, AURAJHIA LEYAONAPetitioner 
 Attorney for BAILEY, AURAJHIA LEYAONATypeBar Number Julie C. RhoAtty for Plaintiff/Petitioner36771
AGOSTO, MAKAI JAKOBEMinor 
BRAYLOCK-AGOSTO, MICHAEL JAVONMinor 
BRAYLOCK-AGOSTO, MIEIRIE J-LEEMinor 
AGOSTO, MICHAEL JAVONRespondent 
 Filings  e-file document  download filings  e-serve documents 
Filing DateFilingAccessPagesMicrofilm
07/31/2024  FILING FEE RECEIVED $260.00Public0
1 07/31/2024  CASE INFORMATION COVER SHEETPublic1
2 07/31/2024  ASSIGNED TO MATTHEW HUMMEL THOMASPublic1
3 07/31/2024  SUMMONSPublic3
4 07/31/2024  PETITION FOR RESIDENTIAL SCH/PARENTING PLAN/CHILD SUPPORTPublic8
5 07/31/2024  SEALED COPY OF BIRTH CERTIFICATE(S)Confidential8
6 07/31/2024  PROPOSED PARENTING PLANPublic10
7 07/31/2024  NOTICE RE: DEPENDENT OF MILITARY PERSONPublic2
8 10/07/2024  CORRESPONDENCEPublic1
9 10/18/2024  DECLARATION OF MAUREEN PARKERPublic4
10 10/28/2024  SEALED CONFIDENTIAL REPORTS 18-2-01379-3Confidential21
11 10/28/2024  SEALED CONFIDENTIAL REPORTS 24-2-01707-6Confidential53
12 10/28/2024  DECLARATION OF KHALILAH BRAYLOCKPublic3
13 10/28/2024  DECLARATION OF PETITIONER IN SUPPORTPublic7
14 10/28/2024  MOTION AND AFFIDAVIT FOR TEMPORARY ORDERPublic5
15 12/03/2024  ORDER SETTING CASE SCHEDULE ADDENDUMPublic1
16 12/03/2024  ORDER SETTING ORIGINAL CASE SCHEDULEPublic1
17 12/16/2024  NOTE FOR COMMISSIONERS CALENDARPublic2
18 12/23/2024  HEARING INFORMATION FORMPublic1
19 01/16/2025  AFFIDAVIT/DECLARATION OF DUE DILIGENCEPublic7
20 01/27/2025  NOTE FOR COMMISSIONERS CALENDARPublic2
21 03/03/2025  ORDER SETTING CASE SCHEDULE ADDENDUMPublic1
22 03/03/2025  ORDER SETTING ORIGINAL CASE SCHEDULEPublic1
23 03/03/2025  COPY(S) OF EMAIL(S)Public3
04/23/2025  EX PARTE PRESENTATION FEE $40.00Public0
24 04/23/2025  MOTION AND AFFIDAVIT RE: SERVICEPublic3
25 04/23/2025  ORDER RE: SERVICEPublic3
26 05/23/2025  RESPONSEPublic5
27 06/13/2025  ORDER SETTING CASE SCHEDULE ADDENDUMPublic1
28 06/13/2025  ORDER SETTING ORIGINAL CASE SCHEDULEPublic1
29 07/16/2025  ORDER SETTING CASE SCHEDULE ADDENDUMPublic1
30 07/16/2025  ORDER SETTING ORIGINAL CASE SCHEDULEPublic1
31 08/21/2025  ORDER SETTING CASE SCHEDULE ADDENDUMPublic1
32 08/21/2025  ORDER SETTING ORIGINAL CASE SCHEDULEPublic1
33 08/21/2025  ACCEPTANCE OF SERVICEPublic3
34 09/26/2025  ORDER SETTING CASE SCHEDULE ADDENDUMPublic1
35 09/26/2025  COPY(S) OF EMAIL(S)Public3
36 09/26/2025  ASSIGNMENT TO FAMILY COURT 1Public1
37 09/26/2025  ORDER AMENDING CASE SCHEDULEPublic1
Proceedings
DateCalendarOutcome
12/06/2024DEPT 13 – JUDGE THOMAS (Rm. 533 )Continued
Confirmed9:00 Assignment to Set Trial Date 
01/27/2025C1- SHOW CAUSE/FAMILY LAW (Rm. 100 )Cancel via Web-Rescheduled
Confirmed9:00 Motion – Temporary Order 
Scheduled By: Julie Rho
03/07/2025DEPT 13 – JUDGE THOMAS (Rm. 533 )Continued
Confirmed9:00 Assignment to Set Trial Date 
03/24/2025C5 – SHOW CAUSE/FAMILY LAW (Rm. 127 )Cancel via Web-Issue resolved
Confirmed9:00 Motion – Temporary OrderWorking Copies Provided
Scheduled By: Julie Rho
04/23/2025C4 – EXPARTE CALENDAR (Rm. 129 )Held – Motion
Unconfirmed8:30 Exparte Action Mail 
Scheduled By: Julie Rho
06/13/2025DEPT 13 – JUDGE THOMAS (Rm. 533 )Continued
Confirmed9:00 Assignment to Set Trial Date 
07/25/2025DEPT 13 – JUDGE THOMAS (Rm. 533 )Continued
Confirmed9:00 Assignment to Set Trial Date 
08/22/2025DEPT 13 – JUDGE THOMAS (Rm. 533 )Continued
Confirmed9:00 Assignment to Set Trial Date 
10/03/2025FAMILY LAW COURT – ONE (Rm. 2-E )Cancelled/Amend Case Sched
Confirmed9:00 Assignment to Set Trial Date 
02/19/2026FAMILY LAW COURT – ONE (Rm. 2-E )
Confirmed8:45 Status Conference 
04/07/2026FAMILY LAW COURT – ONE (Rm. 2-E )
Confirmed9:00 Trial 
  Pending Case Schedule Items
EventSchedule Date
Certificate of Parenting Class – Petitioner’s (Must be filed on or before)10/02/2024
Certificate of Parenting Class – Respondent’s (Must be filed on or before)10/02/2024
Plaintiff’s/Petitioner’s Disclosure of Primary Witnesses12/02/2025
Defendant’s/Respondent’s Disclosure of Primary Witnesses12/23/2025
Disclosure of Rebuttal Witnesses01/06/2026
Deadline for Filing Motion to Adjust Trial Date01/20/2026
Status Conference02/19/2026
Discovery Cutoff03/10/2026
Exchange of Witness and Exhibit Lists and Documentary Exhibits03/24/2026
Trial04/07/2026
 Judgments
Cause #StatusSignedEffectiveFiled
This calendar lists Confirmed and Unconfirmed Proceedings. Attorneys may obtain access rights to confirm/strike selected proceedings. Currently, any proceedings for the Commissioners’ calendars can be stricken, but only Show Cause proceedings for the Commissioners’ calendars can be confirmed. Unconfirmed Proceedings will not be heard unless confirmed as required by the Local Rules of the Superior Court for Pierce County .
Hearing and location information displayed in this calendar is subject to change without notice. Any changes to this information after the creation date and time may not display in current version.Confidential cases and Juvenile Offender proceeding information is not displayed on this calendar. Confidential case types are: Adoption, Paternity, Involuntary Commitment, Dependency, and Truancy.The names provided in this calendar cannot be associated with any particular individuals without individual case research.Neither the court nor clerk makes any representation as to the accuracy and completeness of the data except for court purposes.
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25-2-00358-23 Star Lake Community Club v Cesar Varela

Case Information

25-2-00358-23 | STAR LAKE COMMUNITY CLUB vs CESAR VARELA et al

Case Number
25-2-00358-23

Court
Mason

File Date
06/04/2025

Case Type
FOR Foreclosure

Case Status
Active

Party

Plaintiff
STAR LAKE COMMUNITY CLUB

Active Attorneys

Lead Attorney

Dille, Bryce Haggard
Retained

Bryce Dille, esq.
Bryce Dille, atty & unlicensed collection agency

Bryce Haggard Dille

License Number:2862
License Type:Lawyer
License Status:Active
Eligible To Practice:Yes
WSBA Admit Date: 9/19/1966

Contact Information

Public/Mailing Address:Dille Law PLLC
1800 Cooper Point Rd SW Ste 11
Olympia, WA 98502-1179
United States
Email:bryce@dillelaw.com
Phone:(360) 350-0270
Fax:(253) 845-4941
Website:www.cdb-law.com
TDD:

Professional Liability Insurance

Private Practice:Yes
Has Insurance?Yes – Click for more info
Last Updated:1/16/2025 8:00:00 AM

Current Volunteer Service

Member of the following groups:

Board of Bar ExaminersMemberOctober 2023 — September 2027

Volunteer Service History

GroupPositionStart DateEnd Date
Real Property, Probate & Trust Section Executive CommitteeReal Property Council Member10/1/20219/30/2023
Limited Practice BoardMember1/1/200512/31/2008
WSBA Board of GovernorsWA Congressional District 910/1/20019/30/2004
Disciplinary BoardMember10/1/19969/30/1999
Disciplinary BoardMember1/1/19969/30/1997

Not all WSBA volunteer service will appear here, especially for service on committees/boards that are not standing or for service prior to 1990. (Exception: Service on Board of Governors is captured back through the 1800s.)

Sections

Member of these sections:

Elder Law Section, Real Property Probate and Trust Section, Senior Lawyers Section

Disciplinary History

In some cases, discipline search results will not reveal all disciplinary action relating to a Washington licensed legal professional, and may not display links to the official decision documents.

THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION IS PROVIDED VOLUNTARILY BY THE LICENSED LEGAL PROFESSIONAL. THE INFORMATION MIGHT BE INCOMPLETE, INACCURATE, AND/OR OUT OF DATE.

Practice Information Identified by Legal Professional

Firm or Employer:Dille Law PLLC
Office Type and Size:Law firm with 2-5 WSBA members
Practice Areas:Estate Planning/ Probate/ Wills, Real Property

Defendant
VARELA, CESAR


Defendant
VARELA, JANE DOE

Events and Hearings

  • 1 06/04/2025 Case Information Cover Sheet View Document Case Information Cover Sheet
  • 2 06/04/2025 Summons View Document Summons
  • 3 06/04/2025 Complaint View Document Complaint
  • 4 07/14/2025 Request View Document RequestComment
    TO PAUSE LIEN PROCESS AND APPOINT AN INTERPRETER
  • 5 07/15/2025 Motion and Affidavit Declaration View Document Motion and Affidavit Declaration Comment
    TO PAUSE LIEN ON PROPERTY
  • 6 07/15/2025 Declaration of Mailing View Document Declaration of Mailing
  • 7 07/15/2025 Summons by Publication View Document Summons by Publication
  • 8 07/15/2025 Affidavit View Document Affidavit Comment
    OF BRYCE H. DILLE IN SUPPORT OF PUBLICATION
  • 9 07/15/2025 Affidavit of Diligence View Document Affidavit of Diligence

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Multi-Million E$tate Hans Carl Stoker trust irregularities

Case Information

23-4-00859-34 | Estate of HANS CARL STOKER

Case Number
23-4-00859-34

Court
Thurston

File Date
09/14/2023

Case Type
EST Estate

Case Status
Completed/Re-Completed

Party

Petitioner
STOKER, KATHRYN LORENE

Active Attorneys

Lead Attorney

Worth, Cynthia Sue

Retained



Deceased [& incinerated]
STOKER, HANS CARL

Events and Hearings

9 23.9.18 Hans Death Cert 0859
  • 1 09/14/2023 Case Information Cover Sheet View Document Case Information Cover Sheet
  • 2 09/14/2023 Petition for Probate of Will View Document Petition for Probate of Will
  • 3 09/14/2023 Last Will and Testament View Document Last Will and Testament
  • 4 09/14/2023 Oath View Document Oath
  • 5 09/14/2023 Notice of Appointment and Pendency of Probate View Document Notice of Appointment and Pendency of Probate
  • 6 09/14/2023 Notice to Creditors View Document Notice to Creditors
  • 7 09/14/2023 Order Admitting Will Appt Personal Representative Adj Solv View Document Order Admitting Will Appt Personal Representative Adj Solv
  • 09/14/2023 Ex Parte Action With Order
  • 09/14/2023 Case Resolution Personal Representative Guardian Appointed
  • 8 9 09/14/2023 Affidavit of Mailing View Document Affidavit of Mailing
  • 9 09/18/2023 Certified Copy of Death Certificate View Document Certified Copy of Death Certificate
  • 10 09/19/2023 Notice to Creditors View Document Notice to Creditors
  • 11 09/20/2023 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of Probate Documents
  • 12 09/20/2023 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of Probate Documents
  • 13 09/20/2023 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    Kat Stoker
  • 14 09/25/2023 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    John Stoker
  • 15 09/25/2023 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    Chad Stoker
  • 16 10/06/2023 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of Alexander Karst Stoker
  • 17 02/08/2024 Declaration of Completion View Document Declaration of Completion Comment
    of Inventory
  • 18 05/08/2024 Affidavit of Publication View Document Affidavit of Publication
  • 19 03/26/2025 Declaration of Completion View Document Declaration of Completion
  • 20 03/26/2025 Notice of Filing Declaration of Completion View Document Notice of Filing Declaration of Completion
  • 21 03/26/2025 Declaration of Mailing View Document Declaration of Mailing
  • 22 04/04/2025 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of John Stoker
  • 23 04/21/2025 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of Kathryn Lorene Stoker
  • 24 04/21/2025 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of Kathryn Stoker
  • 25 04/21/2025 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of Kathryn Stoker
  • 26 04/21/2025 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of Kathryn Stoker
  • 27 04/21/2025 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of Kathryn Stoker
  • 28 04/21/2025 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of Kathryn Stoker
  • 29 04/21/2025 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of Kathryn Stoker
  • 30 04/22/2025 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of Kathryn Stoker
  • 31 04/24/2025 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of Chad Stoker
  • 32 04/24/2025 Receipts View Document Receipts Comment
    of Chad Stoker

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